In a message dated Sat, 20 Oct 2001  4:36:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time, SuomenkieliMaa <[log in to unmask]> writes:

> --- Elliott Lash <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > 1) doroboo-ni hairaretanda "I was robbed by the
> > thief"
> > where hairareru is the passive form of hairu "to
> > enter"
> > "I suffered from the thief entering"
>
> I understand your point in regard to Nyenya'a but are
> you sure about the above example?  From my years
> living in Tokyo, I'd say one would more likely say
> "(saifu ga) doroboo ni nusumarechatta (i.e.,
> nusumarete shimatta)" instead of using the verb
> _hairu_.  I'll have to ask my J partner about this
> one... would one say hairu in this case.
>
> > 2) akanboo-ni nakareta  "the baby cried"
> > where nakareru is the passive form of naku "to cry"
> > "The baby cried and I was affected in some manner"
>
> Again, this example sounds a little off somehow
> (although, I admit, I'm not a native J-speaker).
> Perhaps "akachan no nakigoe de okosarechatta (i.e.,
> okosarete shimatta)" or "I ended up being awaked by
> the baby's cries"
>
> What do you think?  Is D Tse out there - I'd like to
> hear his opinion too...
>
> Matt33
>


Sorry for the late response. I learned Japanese for two years, but admittedly I was learning a more formal variety, and therein perhaps arises the confusion. I did, in any case, check these out in my Grammar Book....but I'll leave it up to native speakers too. :)

Elliott