On 5/6/07, Roger Mills <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>
> I think that's the more logical thing to do, rather than trying to work with
> really ancient stages.

The work would be far too complex than I want to even touch, so, I
think for an amateur like myself, it's far easier to work with more
modern stages, and even start with the beginnings of modern languages


>
> Right on all counts. My only surprise was that C(E,I) and G(E,I) don't also
> palatalize. And what about stress? Is it "masyúng" < mansióne- ?

Well, I had wanted to keep a few harder sounds without palatalizing
everything, but of course, it would be fine to go either way. It's
more stylistic than historical reasons. As for stress, it typically
follows the way it went in Spanish. The outcomes of course would be
either /ts/ or /tS/ for C(E,I), and /j/ for G(E,I)

>
> On the cluster-simplification: apparently it doesn't make any difference if
> they're pre- vs. post-tonic? What about C-R (fácere)?
>

Cluster simplification should depend upon those factors, yes, which is
why the results are essentially as with Spanish, such as for MANSIONE
> mesón Sp, masyúng for this language (I didn´t metasthesize the glide
and /s/). CR would result in /4/ first, then /l/.

I thought the stress on facere was penultimate, since Ralph Penny says
that Spanish words have pretty much all kept the same stress they had
in Latin, so wouldn't facere have been facére? Am I wrong? Ha ha


> I'm especially amused by the two numbers you cite-- adok and katulki, 12 and
> 14-- they're wonderfully deformed!! what about the others?
>

Well...

1- unu
2 - dus*
3 - cis
4 - katul
5- kingki / tsingki (could be modified to tsing)
6- sis
7 - sayti (or seyti if I change to what Jorg brought up :))
8- utu
9 - noybi
10 - dayk/deyk
11 - ungki
12 - duk (the one you cite should be this one, not adok)
13 - ciki
14 - katulki
15 - kingki/tsingki
16 - sengki
20 - binti
30 - cinta
40 - kajanta
50 - tsingkanta
60 - sisanta
70 - sitanta
80 - utanta
90 - nunanta
100 - kintu, or tsintu (if I palatalize without going past this stage)

*How funny, "dus" comes close to sounding like the word for two in
Hiligaynon "duha" if we ignore where the accent falls. There is also
"dusa" in paiwanic.

** Seeing how 5 and 15 end up the same through the sound changes, I
may have to rethink this one, or add an epenthetic vowel. Which by the
way, I am considering adding to the ends, rather than the beginnings.


> Otherwise I don't see much to argue about :-) It'll be interesting to see
> some more extensive texts.
>

Why thank you :).

These two families aren't easy to reconcile and I can see why you
don't like it because of that. Hell, *I* Might not like it as I work
on it.