Paul Kershaw wrote:
> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: Brett Williams <[log in to unmask]> But all I actually mean
>> is a language where what's invented & optimized for is just typed
>> characters.  In the same way that most conlangers go along choosing
>> sounds for their words, but not considering how they might be
>> signed, 

Most conlangers? Maybe - I'm not sure. Speaking for myself, I've always 
done _both_ at the same time.

>> you could simply create typed words and not worry about how
>> they would be spoken or brought into any other medium.  The words
>> of the language could be just like "jkjk" and "fgdjjd", and that's
>> what the word is, "fgdjjd", so if you want to say "fgdjjd" the only
>> way to say it is to type f-g-d-j-j-d, and that's just what it is.

Yes, but it does *not* mean that the _only_ way is to say it [Ef dZi di 
dZej dZej di]!

If you follow the rules of Babm [bO'a:bOmu] "fgdjjd" would be pronounced 
[fugadezizide]; if you follow the rules of my own Piashi, it is 
[fuJituLiLitu] (but would have no stressed syllable).

Nor do I think it's only Fuishiki Okamoto and myself (quite 
independently, as it happens) who have thought "Let's just read words by 
just spelling out each letter." The result, surely, depends, what names 
you give each letter/character.

> Is there a reason why you're characterizing this as a typed language
> rather than merely as a written language?
> 
> To me (and others), keeping to the "typewritten" notion suggests that
> there's something inherent about the mechanism of the typewriter
> keyboard that's relevant. 

Quite so - that's what puzzled me. From the description Brett gives the 
words would surely just be combos of Roman (lower-case) script. I notice 
all the examples are combos of letters normally reserved for consonant 
values. Is this deliberate?

> But if your idea is that letters have an irrelevant or non-predefined
> phonetic value, that could be done just as easily with pen-and-paper,
> no?

Yes. Not only could it be done, it has been done. In 1935 Reginald 
Dutton published his 'International Symbolic Script'. It used 
combinations of the modern Roman alphabet _without any regard to 
pronunciation_. He used all the available letters as well the ampersand; 
here is a sample:

moa j za t aic d t zma & t av d t zt.hzs & hos; oy.ym jr kps egr k j p 
gzn gr xfu m t uqaqs on tg.ma t phps ........

"To shut me from the light of the sky  and the sight of the fields and 
flowers; to chain  my feet so  that I can never again ride with the 
soldiers nor climb the hills ......."

Dutton's friend, the Reverend F.W.G. Foat, persuaded him to change the 
language so that it could be pronounced, hence Speedwords was born. But 
IMHO Dutton would have been better advised to stick with his original 
ISS and devise simple pronunciation rules for it.

-- 
Ray
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