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CONLANG  August 2008, Week 4

CONLANG August 2008, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Language Sketch: Gogido

From:

Eldin Raigmore <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 28 Aug 2008 11:38:33 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (189 lines)

On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:59:38 -0400, Jim Henry <[log in to unmask]> 
>wrote:
>On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:19 PM, Logan Kearsley
>><[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>[snip]
>> There's no grammatical number, gender, or case, and tense is optional
>> (marked with tense/aspect particles).
>What about valency, evidentiality and mood?  I seem to recall from
>a summary someone (Tom Chappell?) posted a while ago of a
>cross-linguistic study of verb inflection and derivation that valency
>is marked on verbs in more language than any other category,
>and mood is marked in more languages than tense or aspect.
>Can't remember where evidentiality/validationality stand in
>the ranking.  
>[snip]

You should probably read all of
Item #129431 (19 Dec 2005 12:04) - Re: Transitivity marking on verbs.
< http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?
A2=ind0512C&L=CONLANG&P=R5985&D=1&H=0&O=T&T=1 >

I'm not going to quote the whole thing, though I think almost all of it is 
relevant to this question.

But here's the _most_ relevant part:

[quote]

According to Thomas E. Payne's "Describing Morphology", and also to Joan L. 
Bybee's "Morphology: A Study of the Relation between Meaning and Form" 
(Typological Studies in Language #9; John Benjamins Publishing Company, 
P241.B9 1985), "valence" is the commonest morphology on verbs.  84% of 
languages in Bybee's 50-language, one-language-per-"phylum" sample had 
valence derivation, and 6% had valence inflection. (Consult her book for 
the difference between derivation and inflection, as she used those terms 
in her book.)

She considered valence, voice, aspect (not including "perfect"* 
or "retrospective"), tense (including "perfect"* or "retrospective"), mood 
(including evidentials), number agreement with any one or more argument(s), 
person agreement with any one or more argument(s), and gender agreement 
with any one or more argument(s).  (Bybee used a somewhat restricted 
definition of "mood", yet it was still the semantically-broadest of all of 
these categories.  Consult her book for the definition of "mood" she used 
in it.)

*(BTW I would have included "perfect" as a mood, rather than a tense; but 
at any rate Bybee agrees with me that it is not an aspect.)

In order by fraction of sampled languages which marked them either by 
inflection or derivation, either an affix or a stem-change, the categories 
were;
90% valence
74% aspect
68% mood
66% number
56% voice (tied with person)
56% person (tied with voice)
50% tense
28% person of a second participant (e.g. object)
16% gender

In order by fraction of sampled languages which marked them by inflection, 
the categories were;
68% mood
56% person
54% number
52% aspect
48% tense
28% person of a second participant (e.g. object)
26% voice
16% gender
6%  valence

This next table doesn't come from Bybee; I got these values by subtracting 
the values in the table above.  In order by fraction of sampled languages 
which marked them by derivation only (not by inflection), the categories 
were;
84% valence
30% voice
22% aspect
12% number
2%  tense
0%  mood
0%  person
0%  person of a second participant (e.g. object)
0%  gender

Bybee says the most frequent type of valence morpheme was causatives.

If you are going to mark valence on _every_ verb, then, in your conlang, 
valence will be an _inflectional_, rather than a _derivational_, category, 
as far as Bybee's use of those terms would go.  (The biggest difference 
between "derivation" and "inflection" is that an "inflectional" feature is 
obligatory and productive -- there is a way to mark every value of that 
feature on any new word in the open class (verbs, in this case) -- 
while "derivation" is optional and not completely productive -- not every 
word in the class (in this case, verbs) has to be marked for the feature, 
and some values of the feature cannot be marked on some words in the 
class.)  As you can see from above, Bybee found that, while valence-marking 
is "nearly universal", _inflection_ for valence is rather rare.

[/quote]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also relevant:
Item #128737 (21 Nov 2005 13:16) - Re: Test for middle voice?
< http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?
A2=ind0511C&L=CONLANG&P=R8159&D=1&H=0&O=T&T=1 >
says:
[quote]
Thomas E. Payne in "Describing Morphosyntax"(1997) says Joan Bybee 
in "Morphology"(1985) says that valence-adjusting and voice are the most 
common morphology marked on verbs. 84% of languages have derivations 
marking valency or voice, and another 6% have inflections marking valency or 
voice, so 90% of languages mark their verbs with valency or voice somehow.  
Aspect is second at 74%, and mood, mode, and modality is third at 68%.  (I 
have not had a chance to read Bybee's work yet, so I do not know whether 
she includes retrospective ("perfect") and prospective as aspects, which is 
traditional, or as moods or modes or modalities, which I believe is correct; nor 
whether she includes evidentials and miratives and mediatives among the 
moods and modes and modalities.  That could reverse the order of Aspect and 
Mood, or maybe not.)  Tense is only seventh, at 50%.  However AMT (usually 
written TAM) is usually inflectional rather than derivational, while voice and 
valency are usually derivational rather than inflectional, so TAM dominate 
inflection of verbs, even though voice and valency dominate morphology of 
verbs overall.
[/quote]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Two more posts which might be not-too-tangentially relevant (or, at least, 
interesting);

Item #129130 (6 Dec 2005 22:17) - Re: isolating is equivalent to inflected
< http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?
A2=ind0512A&L=CONLANG&P=R10151&D=1&H=0&O=T&T=1 >
says:
[quote]
In "my" book (the one my public library borrowed from some other 
library) these examples are on page 55.  They are in subsection 1.2 in 
Section 1, "The Basic-Derived Relation", of Chapter 3, "The 
Organization of Paradigms", in Part I, "Morphology and Morpho-
Phonemics".
She says these examples come from "Bybee and Brewer 1980", which would 
be Lingua 52.271-312, "Explanation in Morphophonemics: Changes in 
Provencal and Spanish Preterite Forms".
*From Joan L. Bybee's "Morphology", (which is referred to by Thomas E. 
Payne's "Describing Morphosyntax")
(Typological Studies in Language 9
Joan L. Bybee (SUNY at Buffalo)
Morphology
A Study of the Relation Between Meaning and Form
John Benjamins Publishing Company
P241.B9 1985 (Dewey number 415)
ISSN 0167-7373 v.9
ISBN 0-915027-38-0)
[/quote]

Item #129158 (7 Dec 2005 20:00) - Re: What's a good isolating language to 
look at
< http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?
A2=ind0512A&L=CONLANG&P=R12019&D=1&H=0&O=T&T=1 >
says:
[quote]
Joan L. Bybee answered the question João Ricardo de Mendonça asks of 
Ray A. Brown "No" in her "Morphology" book (1985).  (Incidentally, 
she's at the University of New Mexico now; and she is the same author 
as the Joan B. Hooper who published from around 1972 (or before) to 
around 1981 (or after), tho' she apparently started using Joan L. 
Bybee (again?) in 1980 or before.)
Bybee quotes Sapir as having also decided that there weren't any 
purely isolating, nor purely polysynthetic, nor purely agglutinating, 
nor purely fusing languages, IIRC; and quotes counts collected by 
Thorndike supporting such a conclusion.
Bybee makes her own point, that, the derivational morphology of a 
language is likely to be more towards the fusing (as opposed to the 
agglutinating) end than the inflectional morphology of the same 
language.  (Of course, she also makes the point -- and I know she was 
not the first author I read to make it -- that, in any given 
language, the dividing line between "derivation" and "inflection" 
is "fuzzy".)  She backs it up with several examples; Slavic aspectual 
affixes that have more semantic content than just aspect; patient-
number-agreement affixes in various (mostly ergative) languages that 
have more semantic content than just grammatical number of patients; 
etc.
[/quote]

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December 2007, Week 3
December 2007, Week 2
December 2007, Week 1
November 2007, Week 5
November 2007, Week 4
November 2007, Week 3
November 2007, Week 2
November 2007, Week 1
October 2007, Week 5
October 2007, Week 4
October 2007, Week 3
October 2007, Week 2
October 2007, Week 1
September 2007, Week 5
September 2007, Week 4
September 2007, Week 3
September 2007, Week 2
September 2007, Week 1
August 2007, Week 5
August 2007, Week 4
August 2007, Week 3
August 2007, Week 2
August 2007, Week 1
July 2007, Week 5
July 2007, Week 4
July 2007, Week 3
July 2007, Week 2
July 2007, Week 1
June 2007, Week 5
June 2007, Week 4
June 2007, Week 3
June 2007, Week 2
June 2007, Week 1
May 2007, Week 5
May 2007, Week 4
May 2007, Week 3
May 2007, Week 2
May 2007, Week 1
April 2007, Week 5
April 2007, Week 4
April 2007, Week 3
April 2007, Week 2
April 2007, Week 1
March 2007, Week 5
March 2007, Week 4
March 2007, Week 3
March 2007, Week 2
March 2007, Week 1
February 2007, Week 4
February 2007, Week 3
February 2007, Week 2
February 2007, Week 1
January 2007, Week 5
January 2007, Week 4
January 2007, Week 3
January 2007, Week 2
January 2007, Week 1
December 2006, Week 5
December 2006, Week 4
December 2006, Week 3
December 2006, Week 2
December 2006, Week 1
November 2006, Week 5
November 2006, Week 4
November 2006, Week 3
November 2006, Week 2
November 2006, Week 1
October 2006, Week 5
October 2006, Week 4
October 2006, Week 3
October 2006, Week 2
October 2006, Week 1
September 2006, Week 5
September 2006, Week 4
September 2006, Week 3
September 2006, Week 2
September 2006, Week 1
August 2006, Week 5
August 2006, Week 4
August 2006, Week 3
August 2006, Week 2
August 2006, Week 1
July 2006, Week 5
July 2006, Week 4
July 2006, Week 3
July 2006, Week 2
July 2006, Week 1
June 2006, Week 5
June 2006, Week 4
June 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 2
June 2006, Week 1
May 2006, Week 5
May 2006, Week 4
May 2006, Week 3
May 2006, Week 2
May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 5
April 2006, Week 4
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 5
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3
March 2006, Week 2
March 2006, Week 1
February 2006, Week 4
February 2006, Week 3
February 2006, Week 2
February 2006, Week 1
January 2006, Week 5
January 2006, Week 4
January 2006, Week 3
January 2006, Week 2
January 2006, Week 1
December 2005, Week 5
December 2005, Week 4
December 2005, Week 3
December 2005, Week 2
December 2005, Week 1
November 2005, Week 5
November 2005, Week 4
November 2005, Week 3
November 2005, Week 2
November 2005, Week 1
October 2005, Week 5
October 2005, Week 4
October 2005, Week 3
October 2005, Week 2
October 2005, Week 1
September 2005, Week 5
September 2005, Week 4
September 2005, Week 3
September 2005, Week 2
September 2005, Week 1
August 2005, Week 5
August 2005, Week 4
August 2005, Week 3
August 2005, Week 2
August 2005, Week 1
July 2005, Week 5
July 2005, Week 4
July 2005, Week 3
July 2005, Week 2
July 2005, Week 1
June 2005, Week 5
June 2005, Week 4
June 2005, Week 3
June 2005, Week 2
June 2005, Week 1
May 2005, Week 5
May 2005, Week 4
May 2005, Week 3
May 2005, Week 2
May 2005, Week 1
April 2005, Week 5
April 2005, Week 4
April 2005, Week 3
April 2005, Week 2
April 2005, Week 1
March 2005, Week 5
March 2005, Week 4
March 2005, Week 3
March 2005, Week 2
March 2005, Week 1
February 2005, Week 4
February 2005, Week 3
February 2005, Week 2
February 2005, Week 1
January 2005, Week 5
January 2005, Week 4
January 2005, Week 3
January 2005, Week 2
January 2005, Week 1
December 2004, Week 5
December 2004, Week 4
December 2004, Week 3
December 2004, Week 2
December 2004, Week 1
November 2004, Week 5
November 2004, Week 4
November 2004, Week 3
November 2004, Week 2
November 2004, Week 1
October 2004, Week 5
October 2004, Week 4
October 2004, Week 3
October 2004, Week 2
October 2004, Week 1
September 2004, Week 5
September 2004, Week 4
September 2004, Week 3
September 2004, Week 2
September 2004, Week 1
August 2004, Week 5
August 2004, Week 4
August 2004, Week 3
August 2004, Week 2
August 2004, Week 1
July 2004, Week 5
July 2004, Week 4
July 2004, Week 3
July 2004, Week 2
July 2004, Week 1
June 2004, Week 5
June 2004, Week 4
June 2004, Week 3
June 2004, Week 2
June 2004, Week 1
May 2004, Week 5
May 2004, Week 4
May 2004, Week 3
May 2004, Week 2
May 2004, Week 1
April 2004, Week 5
April 2004, Week 4
April 2004, Week 3
April 2004, Week 2
April 2004, Week 1
March 2004, Week 5
March 2004, Week 4
March 2004, Week 3
March 2004, Week 2
March 2004, Week 1
February 2004, Week 5
February 2004, Week 4
February 2004, Week 3
February 2004, Week 2
February 2004, Week 1
January 2004, Week 5
January 2004, Week 4
January 2004, Week 3
January 2004, Week 2
January 2004, Week 1
December 2003, Week 5
December 2003, Week 4
December 2003, Week 3
December 2003, Week 2
December 2003, Week 1
November 2003, Week 5
November 2003, Week 4
November 2003, Week 3
November 2003, Week 2
November 2003, Week 1
October 2003, Week 5
October 2003, Week 4
October 2003, Week 3
October 2003, Week 2
October 2003, Week 1
September 2003, Week 5
September 2003, Week 4
September 2003, Week 3
September 2003, Week 2
September 2003, Week 1
August 2003, Week 5
August 2003, Week 4
August 2003, Week 3
August 2003, Week 2
August 2003, Week 1
July 2003, Week 5
July 2003, Week 4
July 2003, Week 3
July 2003, Week 2
July 2003, Week 1
June 2003, Week 5
June 2003, Week 4
June 2003, Week 3
June 2003, Week 2
June 2003, Week 1
May 2003, Week 5
May 2003, Week 4
May 2003, Week 3
May 2003, Week 2
May 2003, Week 1
April 2003, Week 5
April 2003, Week 4
April 2003, Week 3
April 2003, Week 2
April 2003, Week 1
March 2003, Week 5
March 2003, Week 4
March 2003, Week 3
March 2003, Week 2
March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
February 2003, Week 3
February 2003, Week 2
February 2003, Week 1
January 2003, Week 5
January 2003, Week 4
January 2003, Week 3
January 2003, Week 2
January 2003, Week 1
December 2002, Week 5
December 2002, Week 4
December 2002, Week 3
December 2002, Week 2
December 2002, Week 1
November 2002, Week 5
November 2002, Week 4
November 2002, Week 3
November 2002, Week 2
November 2002, Week 1
October 2002, Week 5
October 2002, Week 4
October 2002, Week 3
October 2002, Week 2
October 2002, Week 1
September 2002, Week 5
September 2002, Week 4
September 2002, Week 3
September 2002, Week 2
September 2002, Week 1
August 2002, Week 5
August 2002, Week 4
August 2002, Week 3
August 2002, Week 2
August 2002, Week 1
July 2002, Week 5
July 2002, Week 4
July 2002, Week 3
July 2002, Week 2
July 2002, Week 1
June 2002, Week 5
June 2002, Week 4
June 2002, Week 3
June 2002, Week 2
June 2002, Week 1
May 2002, Week 5
May 2002, Week 4
May 2002, Week 3
May 2002, Week 2
May 2002, Week 1
April 2002, Week 5
April 2002, Week 4
April 2002, Week 3
April 2002, Week 2
April 2002, Week 1
March 2002, Week 5
March 2002, Week 4
March 2002, Week 3
March 2002, Week 2
March 2002, Week 1
February 2002, Week 4
February 2002, Week 3
February 2002, Week 2
February 2002, Week 1
January 2002, Week 5
January 2002, Week 4
January 2002, Week 3
January 2002, Week 2
January 2002, Week 1
December 2001, Week 5
December 2001, Week 4
December 2001, Week 3
December 2001, Week 2
December 2001, Week 1
November 2001, Week 5
November 2001, Week 4
November 2001, Week 3
November 2001, Week 2
November 2001, Week 1
October 2001, Week 5
October 2001, Week 4
October 2001, Week 3
October 2001, Week 2
October 2001, Week 1
September 2001, Week 5
September 2001, Week 4
September 2001, Week 3
September 2001, Week 2
September 2001, Week 1
August 2001, Week 5
August 2001, Week 4
August 2001, Week 3
August 2001, Week 2
August 2001, Week 1
July 2001, Week 5
July 2001, Week 4
July 2001, Week 3
July 2001, Week 2
July 2001, Week 1
June 2001, Week 5
June 2001, Week 4
June 2001, Week 3
June 2001, Week 2
June 2001, Week 1
May 2001, Week 5
May 2001, Week 4
May 2001, Week 3
May 2001, Week 2
May 2001, Week 1
April 2001, Week 5
April 2001, Week 4
April 2001, Week 3
April 2001, Week 2
April 2001, Week 1
March 2001, Week 5
March 2001, Week 4
March 2001, Week 3
March 2001, Week 2
March 2001, Week 1
February 2001, Week 4
February 2001, Week 3
February 2001, Week 2
February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
January 2001, Week 4
January 2001, Week 3
January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
December 2000, Week 4
December 2000, Week 3
December 2000, Week 2
December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
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November 2000, Week 3
November 2000, Week 2
November 2000, Week 1
October 2000, Week 5
October 2000, Week 4
October 2000, Week 3
October 2000, Week 2
October 2000, Week 1
September 2000, Week 5
September 2000, Week 4
September 2000, Week 3
September 2000, Week 2
September 2000, Week 1
August 2000, Week 5
August 2000, Week 4
August 2000, Week 3
August 2000, Week 2
August 2000, Week 1
July 2000, Week 5
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July 2000, Week 2
July 2000, Week 1
June 2000, Week 5
June 2000, Week 4
June 2000, Week 3
June 2000, Week 2
June 2000, Week 1
May 2000, Week 5
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May 2000, Week 1
April 2000, Week 5
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April 2000, Week 3
April 2000, Week 2
April 2000, Week 1
March 2000, Week 5
March 2000, Week 4
March 2000, Week 3
March 2000, Week 2
March 2000, Week 1
February 2000, Week 5
February 2000, Week 4
February 2000, Week 3
February 2000, Week 2
February 2000, Week 1
January 2000, Week 5
January 2000, Week 4
January 2000, Week 3
January 2000, Week 2
January 2000, Week 1
December 1999, Week 5
December 1999, Week 4
December 1999, Week 3
December 1999, Week 2
December 1999, Week 1
November 1999, Week 5
November 1999, Week 4
November 1999, Week 3
November 1999, Week 2
November 1999, Week 1
October 1999, Week 5
October 1999, Week 4
October 1999, Week 3
October 1999, Week 2
October 1999, Week 1
September 1999, Week 5
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September 1999, Week 2
September 1999, Week 1
August 1999, Week 5
August 1999, Week 4
August 1999, Week 3
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July 1999, Week 5
July 1999, Week 4
July 1999, Week 3
July 1999, Week 2
July 1999, Week 1
June 1999, Week 5
June 1999, Week 4
June 1999, Week 3
June 1999, Week 2
June 1999, Week 1
May 1999, Week 5
May 1999, Week 4
May 1999, Week 3
May 1999, Week 2
May 1999, Week 1
April 1999, Week 5
April 1999, Week 4
April 1999, Week 3
April 1999, Week 2
April 1999, Week 1
March 1999, Week 5
March 1999, Week 4
March 1999, Week 3
March 1999, Week 2
March 1999, Week 1
February 1999, Week 5
February 1999, Week 4
February 1999, Week 3
February 1999, Week 2
February 1999, Week 1
January 1999, Week 5
January 1999, Week 4
January 1999, Week 3
January 1999, Week 2
January 1999, Week 1
December 1998, Week 5
December 1998, Week 4
December 1998, Week 3
December 1998, Week 2
December 1998, Week 1
November 1998, Week 5
November 1998, Week 4
November 1998, Week 3
November 1998, Week 2
November 1998, Week 1
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October 1998, Week 4
October 1998, Week 3
October 1998, Week 2
October 1998, Week 1
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