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Hallo conlangers!
On 23/01/2018 17:35, David McCann wrote:
> On Mon, 22 Jan 2018 21:57:07 +0100
> Jörg Rhiemeier <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Also, Greenberg's proposal is based on poor method - compiling large
>> lists of lexical similarities *without* establishing regular sound
>> correspondences (this equally holds for his "Eurasiatic").
> So you'd reject Afro-Asiatic and Sino-Tibetan then? Neither of these
> have an agreed reconstruction of the proto-language and a list of the
> sound changes that create the daughter languages. And why do Uralicists
> have symbols for "any front vowel" and "any back vowel"? Because the
> changes there are not always regular, so the vowel cannot be
> reconstructed except for its function in harmony.
I wouldn't reject either Afro-Asiatic or Sino-Tibetan because there are
clearly cognate morphologies, even though lexical reconstruction may be
wanting. Indo-European was established just that way, too, as you will
certainly know. Lexical cognates came later. I would even be so bold to
say that the morphological resemblances between Indo-European and Uralic
are very, very, very hard to explain otherwise than by descent from a
common ancestor that may have been spoken perhaps 8,000 to 10,000 years
ago somewhere north of the Caspian Sea. Some other language families
also show such affinities, though at a lesser degree. They'd be more
distantly related. The morphologies of Afro-Asiatic and Dravidian,
though, are wholly different from this; and Bomhard does not reconstruct
a comprehensive morphological system of Proto-Nostratic but presents a
smörgåsbord of morphemes from which each family "picked" some and in
which each category is represented multiple times. I simply can't
believe that any language could have as many as six different
first-person morphemes.
I know that there are cover symbols in Uralic, too, which is of course
also an established family. There are even such cases in Indo-European,
where there are numerous words where we know that there was a laryngeal
but not which one. It is all a matter of *degree*, though. If you look
at Dolgopolsky's Proto-Nostratic, there are almost as many cover symbols
as there are "known" segments.
I see we disagree on these matters, and have disagreed in the past. I
would not say that the various proposed macrofamilies can't be true -
many of them indeed seem rather plausible - but I am unconvinced by most
of the proposals I have seen. We can leave it at that. And at any rate,
such proposals can be used as a source of inspiration for conlangs!
--
... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
http://www.joerg-rhiemeier.de/Conlang/index.html
"Bêsel asa Éam, a Éam atha cvanthal a cvanth atha Éamal." - SiM 1:1
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January 2001, Week 1 December 2000, Week 5 December 2000, Week 4 December 2000, Week 3 December 2000, Week 2 December 2000, Week 1 November 2000, Week 5 November 2000, Week 4 November 2000, Week 3 November 2000, Week 2 November 2000, Week 1 October 2000, Week 5 October 2000, Week 4 October 2000, Week 3 October 2000, Week 2 October 2000, Week 1 September 2000, Week 5 September 2000, Week 4 September 2000, Week 3 September 2000, Week 2 September 2000, Week 1 August 2000, Week 5 August 2000, Week 4 August 2000, Week 3 August 2000, Week 2 August 2000, Week 1 July 2000, Week 5 July 2000, Week 4 July 2000, Week 3 July 2000, Week 2 July 2000, Week 1 June 2000, Week 5 June 2000, Week 4 June 2000, Week 3 June 2000, Week 2 June 2000, Week 1 May 2000, Week 5 May 2000, Week 4 May 2000, Week 3 May 2000, Week 2 May 2000, Week 1 April 2000, Week 5 April 2000, Week 4 April 2000, Week 3 April 2000, Week 2 April 2000, Week 1 March 2000, Week 5 March 2000, Week 4 March 2000, Week 3 March 2000, Week 2 March 2000, Week 1 February 2000, Week 5 February 2000, Week 4 February 2000, Week 3 February 2000, Week 2 February 2000, Week 1 January 2000, Week 5 January 2000, Week 4 January 2000, Week 3 January 2000, Week 2 January 2000, Week 1 December 1999, Week 5 December 1999, Week 4 December 1999, Week 3 December 1999, Week 2 December 1999, Week 1 November 1999, Week 5 November 1999, Week 4 November 1999, Week 3 November 1999, Week 2 November 1999, Week 1 October 1999, Week 5 October 1999, Week 4 October 1999, Week 3 October 1999, Week 2 October 1999, Week 1 September 1999, Week 5 September 1999, Week 4 September 1999, Week 3 September 1999, Week 2 September 1999, Week 1 August 1999, Week 5 August 1999, Week 4 August 1999, Week 3 August 1999, Week 2 August 1999, Week 1 July 1999, Week 5 July 1999, Week 4 July 1999, Week 3 July 1999, Week 2 July 1999, Week 1 June 1999, Week 5 June 1999, Week 4 June 1999, Week 3 June 1999, Week 2 June 1999, Week 1 May 1999, Week 5 May 1999, Week 4 May 1999, Week 3 May 1999, Week 2 May 1999, Week 1 April 1999, Week 5 April 1999, Week 4 April 1999, Week 3 April 1999, Week 2 April 1999, Week 1 March 1999, Week 5 March 1999, Week 4 March 1999, Week 3 March 1999, Week 2 March 1999, Week 1 February 1999, Week 5 February 1999, Week 4 February 1999, Week 3 February 1999, Week 2 February 1999, Week 1 January 1999, Week 5 January 1999, Week 4 January 1999, Week 3 January 1999, Week 2 January 1999, Week 1 December 1998, Week 5 December 1998, Week 4 December 1998, Week 3 December 1998, Week 2 December 1998, Week 1 November 1998, Week 5 November 1998, Week 4 November 1998, Week 3 November 1998, Week 2 November 1998, Week 1 October 1998, Week 5 October 1998, Week 4 October 1998, Week 3 October 1998, Week 2 October 1998, Week 1 September 1998, Week 5 September 1998, Week 4 September 1998, Week 3
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