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CONLANG Home

CONLANG Home

CONLANG  March 2010, Week 3

CONLANG March 2010, Week 3

Subject:

Re: How to make a mess of an ATL (was: Representing /v/ in Greek script)

From:

R A Brown <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 18 Mar 2010 07:12:01 +0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (106 lines)

Jesse Bangs wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 10:01 AM, Jörg Rhiemeier <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> Hallo!
>>
>> On Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:32:52 +0000, R A Brown wrote:
>>
>>> IMO Ill Bethisad has tried to keep too many disparate
>>> developments within one 'universe.'
>> Rightly said.  Ill Bethisad is a mess, and that is one of the reasons
>> why I withdrew from it (other reasons were the unhelpfulness of some
>> important members and a perceived right-wing bias).  One cannot even
>> say *when* IB diverged from our timeline, because there is *so much*
>> that has been changed.
> 
> I have no desire to get into an argument over it, but I will say that
> as a sometime participant in IB, I find its chaotic, patchwork nature
> to be a positive feature, not a negative feature. 

I see it could well be fun for those who like it and, 
covering the whole planet, gives plenty of scope for 
inventiveness   :)

But it seems to me a long way from what I originally 
understood Brithenig to be when i corresponded with Andrew 
many moons ago - the Romancelang spoken in southern Britain 
if the inhabitants had largely, as in Gaul, taken to 
speaking Vulgar Latin.

It's great to see that at least in ill Bethisad the Kurds 
get their own homeland; but I fail to see any connexion with 
a Romance-speaking (southern) Britain. Nor, for that matter, 
why the neither Spain nor Italy were able to become single, 
united countries. And as for the patchwork that are the 
north and south Americas .......

I have nothing against such fantasies or collaborative 
projects per_se.  But by giving this alternative world a 
Brithenig name, it does, perhaps, suggest this is how _the_ 
alternate Brithenig time-line works out.

> The strictly
> realistic, single-point-of-divergence approach to ALT is one way of
> going about it, and it's obviously a popular one, especially among
> people who consider themselves "serious" alt-history buffs. 

This is true.

> But the
> playful shadowing of real-world events that takes up most of IB is, I
> would argue, an equally valid (if somewhat less "realistic") approach.

But I belong to neither camp.  All I wanted to do was given 
a more or less realistic alternative time-line in which the 
creation of TAKE (ancient/Koine Greek without inflexions) as 
an auxlang made sense and vaguely parallel _Latino sine 
flexione_ in our own time-line.  It's TAKE I'm interested 
in, not filling in the details of the 'missing centuries' 
between the Hellenic Empire and the creation of TAKE in, 
presumably, the 20th century.

However, if anyone wished to give flesh to the missing 
history, I would wish it to be done "seriously" - and I 
realize that even a serious approaches could produce more 
than one result.

But if a group of people want to use the Hellenic Empire as 
the start of a "playful shadowing of real-world events", 
that's OK as long as it is clear that neither I nor TAKE are 
associate with it.

Therefore, I have, as I indicated in an earlier email, now 
redone my TAKE pages (except the one on proper names) 
calling the time-line I outline _RHATL_ (Ray's Hellenic 
Alternative Time-Line).  The Acronym makes it personal. This 
gives the two Philips (PN & PBJ) a free hand to develop as 
they wish their own versions of an Hellenic Alternative 
Time-Line (it may well be that the two developments can 
co-exist sensibly in the same time-line).

It also gives a free hand to anyone else who wishes to 
develop a different HALT history to do so, as long as 
different versions clearly distinguish themselves with 
different names.

There would, of course, be no reason why a "playful 
shadowing of real-world events" called ἡ οἰκουμένη should 
not exist, if a group of people so wished (but they would 
have to cope with the neo-Hellenic alphabet & neo-Hellenic 
languages   ;)

> We have different language for naturalistic conlangs, artlangs,
> freaklangs, engelangs, etc. Perhaps we need a similar taxonomy of
> alt-history timelines?

Maybe so. So what do we call the three approaches outlined 
above?

-- 
Ray
==================================
http://www.carolandray.plus.com
==================================
Nid rhy hen neb i ddysgu.
There's none too old to learn.
[WELSH PROVERB]

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