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CONLANG  June 2000, Week 4

CONLANG June 2000, Week 4

Subject:

Re: OT CHAT: Asperger's syndrome

From:

Christophe Grandsire <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 22 Jun 2000 14:12:18 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (182 lines)

At 02:39 22/06/00 GMT, you wrote:
>
>Again, whether an asperger's person has to "conduct their
>social relations in a purely conscious and artificial
>manner", well, yes, we do all have to pass through that
>phase but many sufferers are mild enough that this does not
>remain true in their adult life, or at least it's an
>exaggeration. On the other hand, many others do not, as
>you'd expect with a spectrum disorder. Here at Flinders
>University there are hand-made posters all over the place,
>which are replaced regularly, asking that people who wish to
>make a new friend should email an individual who suffers
>from a somewhat more severe case of asperger's syndrome than
>I do.
>

In my school, there used to be a man who certainly suffers from this
syndrome. As far as I know, he is now working as a webmaster of some kind,
staying in front of his computer twenty hours a day and hardly ever going
out. His main problem is not his asociality but the fact that he's truly
evil (I didn't think true evil could exist before I met him). And I don't
associate evil with Asperger's syndrome, I just say that besides this
syndrome (he must be a really severe case, my boyfriend told me once that
this man thought he was the only real person in the world, all the others
were automats of some kind), he is truly evil (I hope for you you'll never
meet him, it's quite awful to stay in his presence).

>There *are* things that I can't do naturally. For example I
>_cannot_ fake a smile for a camera, nor can I blend in well
>for a group photograph, so pictures typically show me
>looking somewhat aloof. (As a child I remember being told to
>stop making funny faces and being genuinely bewildered
>because I was _convinced_ that what I was doing was smiling.
>These days at least I _know_ that I can't do it.) And I find
>it much easier to make friends on the Internet than in real
>life - social interactions are just far too _dynamic_.

I suffer from these symptoms too, but it's less severe. I never went to a
doctor for that, but my social life has always been minimum. I do feel
easier to make friends on Internet too (in fact, I can account for only one
true friend for a long time, and besides there's my boyfriend who's also my
best friend. They are the only ones I didn't meet on Internet).

>(There's an essay on my website, which I wrote for a
>university English topic, titled : "Is the internet
>destructive to human relationships?"). I cannot participate
>effectively in conversations between more than about three
>people (unless it's a slow thoughtful philosophical
>discussion which I can handle just fine) because I just
>can't get a word in edgeways and not for lack of trying!

In my case, I have what's called "esprit d'escalier". I can find very good
replies to what has been said, but generally only a few minutes after it
has been said. Not good for conversation...

>Somehow people just don't seem to notice that I'm trying to
>speak! And put me in a room with lots of people talking to
>each other all over the place and I just gotta escape.
>Sensory overload has all sorts of nasty effects on my brain,
>and all I can do is withdraw into a corner.
>

I have a true sensorial problem. When in a noisy place (a restaurant, a
canteen, a bar, etc...) I cannot make the difference between the background
and what's said by the people I'm with. I've heard that people didn't have
problems hearing people they are talking with in a noisy place, that's not
my case. And it's not only a lack of attention, even when I really pay
attention the problem's still there. This problem is really awful because
it prevents me from following conversations and participate them. I never
feel more isolated than in a noisy crowd. I can read lips a little, but it
hardly helps.

>However, the world is full of people with the same
>difficulties who are not sufferers from any disorder. They
>are typically described simply as "not the social type".
>They interact with the world in ways that are a little
>eccentric but which avoid those areas they find troublesome.
>Most of them have relatively few friends in total but are
>very sincere about the friendships they have. That's what an
>asperger's person like me
>becomes in their adult life, given the ongoing support of
>family and friends.
>

That's a good portrait of me :) .

>Insistence on routine is a big part of asperger's, and one
>that I have always been very conscious of. When I was young
>I adopted the word "trick" to mean an obsessive or
>compulsive action. Like _always_ following a complex ritual
>for turning the shower taps on, or for making breakfast, or
>_always_ giving Dad a hug before he went on the hockey
>field, or _always_ drawing a particular design with tomato
>sauce to be sure of having exactly the right amount. I
>called these tricks; psychiatrists call them patterns. The
>difference is that psychiatrists are describing them from
>an observer's perspective, whereas I know what they're
>really for. I believe my term "trick" derived from the idea
>of a disappearing trick, because the whole point of
>compulsive behaviour is to get rid of (make disappear) that
>intolerable nagging yucky anxious sensation that comes from
>_not_ following the preformulated routine. (As an adult I
>have relatively few obsessions or compulsions - checking
>email first thing in the morning might be one - but I do
>still have a few routines that I have to either follow or
>turn the rest of the day into a complete waste. I won't go
>into examples here and now, which are a lot more subtle than
>the very concrete examples I gave from my childhood.)
>

I don't really have tricks (French call that TOC: Troubles Obsessionnels
Compulsifs) but I do have routine (like dressing the table nearly always
the same way, but it's not a trick because I don't go as far as putting
everything exactly at the same place and in the same order). Just like
everyone else I think.

>There's a myth that asperger's people typically "take things
>literally". That's a half-truth. Better to say that
>"asperger's people typically do not respond to the same cues
>as other people when deciding whether a statement is meant
>literally or not. Therefore they will often take a statement
>literally when it is not intended so, and when a statement
>_is_ intended literally, they will often take it some other
>way." The myth arises for the following reason, which is
>obvious with just a little imagination. If your statement is
>_not_ intended literally and it _is_ _taken_ literally, then
>it is obvious to you what has happened : your statement was
>taken literally. So the impression that asperger's people
>take things literally is easily reenforced. But if your
>statement _is_ intended to be taken literally but your
>audience does _not_ do so, then it is far from obvious what
>has happened (typically you will assume that your audience
>ignored your statement all together) so the fact that
>asperger's people fail to recognise statements that are
>_intended_ literally is _not_ reenforced. You see? When two
>people are responding to different cues about what is
>literal and what is not, eachwill perceive that the other
>tends to take them literally. Speaking very much from
>experience I can tell you that asperger's people often get
>irritated with the way others take *us* literally all the
>time.
>

:) I recognize myself in this :) .

>The reason that asperger's syndrome - even at my very mild
>end of the spectrum - is a problem, is that in our society
>social competence is assumed. I'm repeating almost every
>subject I do at university for reasons I'm not going to go
>into here, but if I had confronted these problems before
>they grew to monstrous proportions by talking to my
>lecturers about them right at the start, then it would have
>made it much easier to manage my study difficulties. But
>such a confrontation is _painful_ to an asperger's person.
>Much easier to withdraw from the world, and believe me I
>know! And think how many things in life require such a
>confrontation to be made. Job interviews come to mind;
>fortunately I'm still a student so I can put them off for a
>while.
>

I have the same problem: interviews are a torture for me (with physical
pain, I swear!). This year I have four oral exams out of eight, it's a real
nightmare. But the worst for me is answering the phone. Until three years
ago it completely paralysed me, preventing me from talking on the phone
even to my family!!! Nowadays it's easier, but not that much, and calling
strangers stays very very difficult (the only person I have asolutely no
trouble calling is my boyfriend in fact). I have a real phobia of the phone.

>That's about all I can think of to say right now.
>

Thank you for this, it was really interesting.

                                                Christophe Grandsire
                                                |Sela Jemufan Atlinan C.G.

"Reality is just another point of view."

homepage : http://rainbow.conlang.free.fr
(ou : http://www.bde.espci.fr/homepages/Christophe.Grandsire/index.html)

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October 2006, Week 5
October 2006, Week 4
October 2006, Week 3
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July 2006, Week 5
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July 2006, Week 2
July 2006, Week 1
June 2006, Week 5
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May 2006, Week 5
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May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 5
April 2006, Week 4
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 5
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3
March 2006, Week 2
March 2006, Week 1
February 2006, Week 4
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February 2006, Week 2
February 2006, Week 1
January 2006, Week 5
January 2006, Week 4
January 2006, Week 3
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January 2006, Week 1
December 2005, Week 5
December 2005, Week 4
December 2005, Week 3
December 2005, Week 2
December 2005, Week 1
November 2005, Week 5
November 2005, Week 4
November 2005, Week 3
November 2005, Week 2
November 2005, Week 1
October 2005, Week 5
October 2005, Week 4
October 2005, Week 3
October 2005, Week 2
October 2005, Week 1
September 2005, Week 5
September 2005, Week 4
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September 2005, Week 2
September 2005, Week 1
August 2005, Week 5
August 2005, Week 4
August 2005, Week 3
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July 2005, Week 1
June 2005, Week 5
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May 2005, Week 1
April 2005, Week 5
April 2005, Week 4
April 2005, Week 3
April 2005, Week 2
April 2005, Week 1
March 2005, Week 5
March 2005, Week 4
March 2005, Week 3
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March 2005, Week 1
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January 2005, Week 3
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January 2005, Week 1
December 2004, Week 5
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December 2004, Week 3
December 2004, Week 2
December 2004, Week 1
November 2004, Week 5
November 2004, Week 4
November 2004, Week 3
November 2004, Week 2
November 2004, Week 1
October 2004, Week 5
October 2004, Week 4
October 2004, Week 3
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October 2004, Week 1
September 2004, Week 5
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September 2004, Week 1
August 2004, Week 5
August 2004, Week 4
August 2004, Week 3
August 2004, Week 2
August 2004, Week 1
July 2004, Week 5
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July 2004, Week 3
July 2004, Week 2
July 2004, Week 1
June 2004, Week 5
June 2004, Week 4
June 2004, Week 3
June 2004, Week 2
June 2004, Week 1
May 2004, Week 5
May 2004, Week 4
May 2004, Week 3
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May 2004, Week 1
April 2004, Week 5
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April 2004, Week 3
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February 2004, Week 1
January 2004, Week 5
January 2004, Week 4
January 2004, Week 3
January 2004, Week 2
January 2004, Week 1
December 2003, Week 5
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December 2003, Week 3
December 2003, Week 2
December 2003, Week 1
November 2003, Week 5
November 2003, Week 4
November 2003, Week 3
November 2003, Week 2
November 2003, Week 1
October 2003, Week 5
October 2003, Week 4
October 2003, Week 3
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October 2003, Week 1
September 2003, Week 5
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September 2003, Week 1
August 2003, Week 5
August 2003, Week 4
August 2003, Week 3
August 2003, Week 2
August 2003, Week 1
July 2003, Week 5
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July 2003, Week 3
July 2003, Week 2
July 2003, Week 1
June 2003, Week 5
June 2003, Week 4
June 2003, Week 3
June 2003, Week 2
June 2003, Week 1
May 2003, Week 5
May 2003, Week 4
May 2003, Week 3
May 2003, Week 2
May 2003, Week 1
April 2003, Week 5
April 2003, Week 4
April 2003, Week 3
April 2003, Week 2
April 2003, Week 1
March 2003, Week 5
March 2003, Week 4
March 2003, Week 3
March 2003, Week 2
March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
February 2003, Week 3
February 2003, Week 2
February 2003, Week 1
January 2003, Week 5
January 2003, Week 4
January 2003, Week 3
January 2003, Week 2
January 2003, Week 1
December 2002, Week 5
December 2002, Week 4
December 2002, Week 3
December 2002, Week 2
December 2002, Week 1
November 2002, Week 5
November 2002, Week 4
November 2002, Week 3
November 2002, Week 2
November 2002, Week 1
October 2002, Week 5
October 2002, Week 4
October 2002, Week 3
October 2002, Week 2
October 2002, Week 1
September 2002, Week 5
September 2002, Week 4
September 2002, Week 3
September 2002, Week 2
September 2002, Week 1
August 2002, Week 5
August 2002, Week 4
August 2002, Week 3
August 2002, Week 2
August 2002, Week 1
July 2002, Week 5
July 2002, Week 4
July 2002, Week 3
July 2002, Week 2
July 2002, Week 1
June 2002, Week 5
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June 2002, Week 3
June 2002, Week 2
June 2002, Week 1
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May 2002, Week 3
May 2002, Week 2
May 2002, Week 1
April 2002, Week 5
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April 2002, Week 3
April 2002, Week 2
April 2002, Week 1
March 2002, Week 5
March 2002, Week 4
March 2002, Week 3
March 2002, Week 2
March 2002, Week 1
February 2002, Week 4
February 2002, Week 3
February 2002, Week 2
February 2002, Week 1
January 2002, Week 5
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January 2002, Week 3
January 2002, Week 2
January 2002, Week 1
December 2001, Week 5
December 2001, Week 4
December 2001, Week 3
December 2001, Week 2
December 2001, Week 1
November 2001, Week 5
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November 2001, Week 1
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October 2001, Week 4
October 2001, Week 3
October 2001, Week 2
October 2001, Week 1
September 2001, Week 5
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September 2001, Week 3
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July 2001, Week 1
June 2001, Week 5
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June 2001, Week 1
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May 2001, Week 2
May 2001, Week 1
April 2001, Week 5
April 2001, Week 4
April 2001, Week 3
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April 2001, Week 1
March 2001, Week 5
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March 2001, Week 3
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March 2001, Week 1
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February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
January 2001, Week 4
January 2001, Week 3
January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
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December 2000, Week 3
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December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
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September 2000, Week 5
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February 2000, Week 5
February 2000, Week 4
February 2000, Week 3
February 2000, Week 2
February 2000, Week 1
January 2000, Week 5
January 2000, Week 4
January 2000, Week 3
January 2000, Week 2
January 2000, Week 1
December 1999, Week 5
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December 1999, Week 1
November 1999, Week 5
November 1999, Week 4
November 1999, Week 3
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October 1999, Week 5
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December 1998, Week 5
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September 1998, Week 5
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September 1998, Week 3

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