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CONLANG  June 2000, Week 4

CONLANG June 2000, Week 4

Subject:

R: Re: R: Re: Old Norse (was Re: New to the list)

From:

Mangiat <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 23 Jun 2000 18:36:57 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (62 lines)

----- Original Message -----
From: Vima Kadphises
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Thursday, June 22, 2000 8:57 PM
Subject: Re: R: Re: Old Norse (was Re: New to the list)

<<
Egregio signore:
Mangiat <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
"Well, in Italian you have even more (litterary Italian): just three days
ago
I received a brochure where it was written: 'La S.V.  invitata allo
spettacolo', where S.V. stands for Signoria Vostra , something like Your
Majesty. No sarcastic style. AFAIR, during the centuries we've had:
LEI (litterary = she) used with strangers, teachers and work bosses. The
gender is female, but it's used even with men (my dialect has somehow
reatined 'l' for men and 'le' for women)."
>>

>>
Luca, where did this form come from?  IIRC, Bruno Migliorini's book "Storia
della lingua italiana" claims that the use of LEI was calqued on Spanish
"usted," but I don't buy it.  It seems awfully like German to me (or perhaps
the German is calqued on the Italian? I dunno).
>>

I don't know where's it from. My mother teaches Italian and literary
subjects (history, latin) in a Junior High School, so my house is full of
grammars, but they don't give such explanations. Anyway I can't believe it
from Spanish 'usted' for two reasons: AFAIR, usted means something like
'you', 2nd plural person, while 'lei' is 'she', 3rd singular female; then
there is the historical reason: I think 'lei' was common even before the
Spanish dominations (even if I'm not sure).

<<
Which dialect do you speak? Not dialatt bulgnais, perchance?
>>

No, fortunately. I can't bear dialects southern than Milanes (not that I am
a 'leghista', obviously. No man whit a little of culture can seriously be
one of them. I simply don't like them - neither I can understand a word...)
I speak the dialect of Como, on the Swiss border. It's something very
difficult, and surely un-Italian for all those used to identify my lovely
language with that mafious jargon they hear on TV. A sentence in my dialect?
Well, let's try a proverb, one of my favs: 'dma givina e omm vecc fan
fij fin al tecc' /'dOna 'dZujna @ 'Om 'vEtS fa~ fi.'Y: fi~ al 'tEtS/, 'a
young woman and an old man will have sons up to the roof' : )

<<
A formal "voi" has an almost fascistic sound to my ears.
>>

No, why? Nowadays it sounds simply sarcastic!

<<
-Carlo
>>

Carlo ??? Hey, where are you from?

Luca

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