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CONLANG  September 2000, Week 3

CONLANG September 2000, Week 3

Subject:

Re: Droppin' Ds

From:

Raymond Brown <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 21 Sep 2000 21:44:14 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (87 lines)

At 11:52 pm -0400 20/9/00, Roger Mills wrote:
[...]
>Strange, but not too far from what actually happened.  A slight byway:
>_some_ classicists have proposed that Latin had a phonemic /N/, at least
>before /n/ as in agnus 'lamb' ::

I've never come across any, myself, so I guess _some_ is not an
overstatement if there are any who take this odd position.

What I am familiar enough with, however, is the notion that /g/ before /n/
was actually pronounced as [N].  There is, as far as I can see, no reason
to suppose any _phonemic_ /N/ in Latin.  It is reasonable to suppose that
/n/ before velars were pronounced [N], i.e. [N] occurred as an allophone of
/g/.  Indeed, the Roman writer, Varro, quite clearly identifies the Latin
_n_ in _angulus_ etc with the Greek gamma in _agkyra_, _egkhos_ etc

I've forgotten all the evidence for the pronunciation of _gn_ as [Nn], i.e.
that [N] was also an _allophone_ of /g/, but I do know that one (and only
one) of the pieces of evidence is the occasional spelling in Latin of such
combinations as _ngn_ ; but to give the reason as...

>somehow the reason for the palatal in Fr.
>agneau, It. agnello.

...is IMHO a trivialization, and conveniently ignores the other evidence.

>A similar proposal has been made for Anc. Greek, with
>to my mind, equally weak evidence.

The combination _gn_ is not common in Greek and there is no clear evidence
one way or the other on the Greek compound.

However, the status of [N] is more problematic in ancient Greek.  One thing
that often strikes people as odd is that [Nk_h], [Nk], [Nks] and [Ng] are
all written with [N] denoted by gamma, i.e. _g_, thus: gkh, gk, gks (gx),
gg.

However, in the inscriptions of the 7th & 6th cents. BC. we find nu used,
i.e. nkh, nk etc.  Why the change?

As Sidney Allen observes, the change makes no sense at all unless gamma had
the sound [N] in some other environment.

Now when a verb whose stem ends in a labial has an ending beginning with
/m/ added, the final labial becomes the labial nasal, e.g.
le-leip-mai --> leleimmai
te-trib-mai --> tetrimmai
ge-graph-mai --> gegrammai

So when we find:
pe-plek-mai --> peplegmai
te-teukh-mai --> teteugmai

It is not unreasonable to suspect that _gm_ is [Nm] and that it was the use
of _g_ in this environment that led to its adoption elswhere to denote [N].
There was also a tradition, ascribed to Ion of Khios, that the _g_ before a
velar was called _agma_ - a strange name to give to a letter representing
[N], unless it was pronounced [aNma].

So why is the status of [N] more problematic?  Simply that the Greeks
_recognized_ it as a distinct sound which needed to be written by the same
latter in all environments.  It would be absurd to suppose the Greeks
thought that [N] before a velar was an allophone of /g/!  Yet it is clear
that once they perceived it as a distinct sound they were no longer content
to write [N] as _n_ in one environment and _g_ in another.

How to write the sound?
There, I think, three possible solutions:
(a) generalize _n_ for all occurrences of [N] - no good, since /nm/ did
occur, thus _nm_ would be ambiguous;
(b) generalize _g_ for all occurrences - fine, since voiced plosives were
not geminated so /gg/ never occurred, thus _gg_ is unambiguously [Ng];
(c) Invent a new letter - unnecessary, as gamma can be used.

And if someone objects that it is not likely that the same letter will be
named gamma when used with one sound and agma when used different, I will
just ask him/her to consider the name of the letter X in Catalan.  It is
_xeix_ /SeS/ or _ics_ /iks/ depending upon its pronunciation within a given
word.


=========================================
A mind which thinks at its own expense
will always interfere with language.
                   [J.G. Hamann 1760]
=========================================

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