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AUXLANG Home

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AUXLANG  August 2001, Week 5

AUXLANG August 2001, Week 5

Subject:

Re: Posting about the book to auxlang

From:

James Chandler <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 31 Aug 2001 12:20:22 +0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (124 lines)

Don rote:

>Could you define what you mean by "informational"? If "informational about
>fine points of distinction between various planned languages", then you are
>probably right. If "informational about other topics, about history, about
>social differences between planned languages, about usability of planned
>languages" then I think you are perhaps suffering from a bit of tunnel
>vision.

By 'informational' i mean anything that brings us information about Esp, its
movement, activities, new publications, etc. etc.  All of this would seem to
me entirely relevant to this list.  So, if you posted a message informing us
of a new book in Esp, providing a URL to a webpage on it, and perhaps
quoting a short excerpt or two to give a flavor of the work, that would be
fine.  On the other hand, what you are doing, ie. posting entire articles in
Esp, sometimes two or three at a time, is blatantly promotional and of
dubious appropriateness here.

>"Blatant" is perhaps a bit excessive. I like to think that they are nice,
>subtle adverts for Esperanto. ;<)

Then the sutlety is lost on me...

>You are, of course, free to ignore them, to delete them as they arrive, or
>even to killfile me. Others have done similar things on this list (I ignore
>a lot of stuff that's posted here, though I haven't deleted anything or
>killfiled anyone yet).

I would never dream of killfiling you, Don!  And like you, i have never yet
done that to any member of this or any other list i am a member of.

>This, I think, is a revisionist view of history. Bruce and I were pretty
>much in agreement that I would pay about as much attention to his
>prejudices as he did to mine. Actually, if you go back and look I think
>you'll find that, every now and then, I didn't hesitate to post an article
>or two. (And, frankly, I'd like to see Bruce come back. I miss the guy.)

Looking back, i remember feeling at the time that Bruce provided some kind
of restraint on your activities on this list, keeping you in check, so to
speak, to some extent.  Since his unfortunate departure you have been free
of any kind of authority, and have been able to follow what was presumably
your original plan.  The results are plain to see.  And, in Bruces absence,
i should point out that he would certainly not accept your characterization
of his views as prejudices (tho as for yours, i think that is open to
debate...).

>Oh, come now. You've gone considerably further than that in the past.
>"Beginning to feel"??? Why, compared to some of the other stuff you've
>posted about me, this hardly qualifies as a mini-rant! James, before long
>you'll start waxing philosophical about the whole thing and teen-agers will
>start referring to you as "the old man".

Well, i am long out of my teenage years now, mores the pity, so perhaps i am
mellowing with age...  But i completely reject your insinuation that my
much-needed criticisms of you on this list have been rants.

>As I understand it, this list was founded to provide a place to relegate
>those who were treating Conlang as an IAL battleground. That it often
>degenerates (if you want to use the term) into an IAL battleground is,
>under the circumstances, hardly surprising. Please quote a document that
>describes whether the system is supposed to be "Marquis of Queensbury",
>"Geneva Convention", or "Take No Prisoners".

I have reread the rules of the list.  To me, they seem to make a distinction
between informing other members about your favorite language, and engaging
in any form of spamming, ie. sending unsolicited advertisements to the list.
  However, the wording is unclear on this point, and only commercial
spamming is explicitly outlawed.  However, i do think there is a suggestion
in there that promotional activities of any sort should be kept modest and
to the point.

Because i am British, i have an inherent sense of fair play, and i suppose i
tend to assume that others will share it.  This assumption is almost
certainly unjustified.

>Now this is at least consistent. A couple of years ago you made essentially
>the same recommendation to Bob Petry about the stuff he was then posting in
>Occidental. I _supported_ you then, which would make me horribly
>inconsistent, except I also pointed out that (a) Bob had a _right_ to post
>the stuff here if he wanted to (which you did not seem to realize), and (b)
>it was the only way he would make sure that people actually _saw_ it.

I never disputed Bobs _right_ to post anything to this list.  I merely
recommended that he modify his methods (tho you have a better recollection
of it than me).  Your (b) betrays your true intentions: you cant leave it to
people to choose whether or not they want to read your texts, so you ram
them down their throats regardless.  Otherwise you would post URLs.

>James, have I ever urged you not to post stuff in Ido? _Have_ you anything
>to post in Ido?

Well of course i have.  I could post evry article from evry Progreso and
Ido-Saluto and Letro Internaciona that lands on my doormat.  But i assume
that if people want to read them, they will subscribe to the magazines.

>My material, and the stuff that Bob used to post, were both topical, the
>difference being that mine is topical now, and his was topical six decades
>ago or thereabouts.

Don, this is exactly the kind of comment we need BRG here to deal with.  You
have twisted and contorted the facts to suit your own ends.  The facts,
untwisted, are:
1. Bob posts sixty year old articles as part of valid discussions about the
history of Occ and Ia.
2. You post current articles in order to promote Esp on this list, when such
activities would be better suited to an Esp-language list or newsgroup, and
NOT AS PART OF ANY DISCUSSION ON THIS LIST.

Kindly refrain from deliberately misleading the members of this list.

Kordiale, James Chandler
[log in to unmask]
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/5037 - IALs index

"Linguistics has been reduced by Chomsky and his disciples to a positively
mind-boggling level of stupidity and insignificance.  If ever the Prime
Minister wants an excuse to close down a university, she has only to look at
its department of linguistics." - Auberon Waugh, Oxymoron to a boiled egg
(1988) [review of The Chomsky Reader, 1987]


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March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
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December 2002, Week 5
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October 2002, Week 5
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March 2001, Week 3
March 2001, Week 2
March 2001, Week 1
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February 2001, Week 2
February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
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January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
December 2000, Week 4
December 2000, Week 3
December 2000, Week 2
December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
November 2000, Week 4
November 2000, Week 3
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November 2000, Week 1
October 2000, Week 5
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October 2000, Week 1
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April 2000, Week 5
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April 2000, Week 3
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March 2000, Week 5
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February 2000, Week 5
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February 2000, Week 1
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December 1999, Week 5
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September 1999, Week 5
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December 1998, Week 5
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December 1997, Week 5
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February 1997, Week 1

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