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CONLANG  April 2002, Week 2

CONLANG April 2002, Week 2

Subject:

Re: New Language: Zhyler (Noun Classes)

From:

jesse stephen bangs <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:11:38 -0700

Content-Type:

TEXT/PLAIN

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

TEXT/PLAIN (70 lines)

David Peterson sikayal:

> language.  One of the things I incorporated (don't ask me why), is what has
> come to be a rather large noun class system (20 classes).  What I was
> wondering is if people who speak languages with noun classes in them could
> take a look at my classes and see if they make sense, seem natural, etc.
> Here it goes (snipped from my Appleworks document):

Well, I echo John in saying that some of these classes are too narrow and
too semantically tight.  The system is suspiciously scientific and
contains a few classes that I would conflate, and others that could be
expanded.  For example:

> ii.) -vEn/ven: Animals that live on the land and have four legs and fur:
> bears, dogs, mice, raccoons, horses...

I find it interesting that "fur" becomes a distinguishing characteristic,
although I can't think of any argument against it.  If I saw this in a
natlang, I'd probably call it delightful.

> v.) -dI/di: Sentient beings that have a job or career or title associated
> with them: king, teacher, blackbelt, sage, lawyer, doctor...

I like the distinction between this and class i.

> x.) -mUs/mus: Animals that crawl along the ocean floor: crabs, sea slugs,
> lobsters...

Um, how many of these are there?  And where do these people live, that
they have a whole class for this kind of creature?  Crab, lobster,
octopus, uhhhh, maybe some kinds of shrimp . . . . that pretty much
exhausts my knowledge of such creatures.

I agree that you should make some of these wider, and add some
image-classes.  That would mix the system up, and make it much more
confusing, which is always good.

BTW, here was the Proto-Yivríndanil noun system, now greatly degraded and
confused in modern Yivríndil:

I, -a: Masculine people

II, -é: Feminine people

III, -u: Masculine animals, animals considered genderless that were
associated with the earth (worms, snakes), parts of the body, most manmade
objects, and natural phenomena that do not change (rocks, mountains)

IV, -ó: Feminine animals, animals considered genderless that were
associated with the air or water (fishes and most birds), plants, and
natural phenomena that change (rivers, weather)

V, -í: Abstract nouns derived from verbs, nouns describing states
(standing, fighting)

VI, -á, -ó, -ú: Nouns describing attributes and emotions (fear, love).
The three different endings provided a gradation of meaning.

In modern Yivríndil, classes II, III, and IV remain pretty distinct, but
I, V, and VI sort of coincided, and various new suffixes made the whole
system obsolete.  It's now only productive in a limited, derivational
sense.

Jesse S. Bangs [log in to unmask]

"If you look at a thing nine hundred and ninety-nine times, you are
perfectly safe; if you look at it the thousandth time, you are in
frightful danger of seeing it for the first time."
--G.K. Chesterton

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