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CONLANG  December 2005, Week 4

CONLANG December 2005, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Slightly OT: dreidel question

From:

Steg Belsky <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 27 Dec 2005 18:47:17 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (35 lines)

On Dec 27, 2005, at 1:17 PM, Mark J. Reed wrote:
> I'm a bit confused about the history of the dreidel and its 
> association with Hanukkah.  I know the dreidel was originally a 
> gambling device (the original d4, in D&D terms).   I know that in the 
> context of the Hanukkah game, the four letters stand for the Yiddish 
> words for "Nothing", "Everything", "Half", and "Put" or "Pay", while 
> in the larger context of Hanukkah itself they are construed as an 
> acronym for the Hebrew phrase "A great miracle happened here/there".
> But which came first?  I have found explanations that give both 
> directions - that the game started with the Yiddish letters which were 
> then reinterpreted as the acronym, or that they started with the 
> acronym and then developed the game mechanics to match.  The latter 
> interpretation seems to be more common, but the information I've found 
> so far is lacking in detail.
> I don't know how old the association is, but if it dates back to the 
> beginning of the Hanukkah custom, then I don't think Yiddish existed 
> yet?
> Sorry for my confusion, but my Google-fu has failed me here.  Any 
> pointers appreciated.
> -- 
> Mark J. Reed <[log in to unmask]>


 From what i've read it seems that the 'practical' meaning of the 
letters predates the 'religious' meaning of them, and that they were 
copied from similar German d4-based games which used similar words.
It's unclear when exactly Yiddish developed into a recognizably 
separate language, but there's a long history of Jews writing their 
vernacular in Hebrew letters.  So even in Yiddish as such hadn't yet 
developed, there was still a kind of Judeo-German being written on the 
dreidls.


-Stephen (Steg)

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