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AUXLANG  June 2006, Week 4

AUXLANG June 2006, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Marking color, or plural above 5 (was: Tweaking Eo)

From:

Thomas Alexander <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 23 Jun 2006 23:25:05 -0700

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (141 lines)

Hi Larry,

I'm picking up where I left off -- although I have
read through some of the more recent notes too.  I
think we understand each other.  At any rate, it's
an interesting exercise to try to make sure that we
do.

> Now, if it were the case that in our everyday
> lives the presence of one thing called for one
> kind of action, and the presence of more than
> one -- regardless of number -- called for a
> different action, then I would see "one" versus
> "not-one" as more fundamental than any other
> distinctions.

I think these situations are not too hard to think
of - especially if you allow yourself to think of
it in terms of "one" vs "expected plural."  Actually,
I thought I already enumerated at least one good
example even taking the idea of "one or not one"
literally.

> But the action called for if I have two mice or two
> wolves is very different from the action called for
> if I have two thousand mice or two hundred wolves.
> What I'm trying to say is that the difference
> between 1 mouse and 2 is miniscule compared to the
> difference between 2 mice and 2,000. But
> grammatically we distinguish the former, not the
> latter.

At least one reason for this is that with the numbers
our ancestors had to deal with, there is a cleaner
distinction between "one", "a few", and "many" than
there are between "one" "a thousand" and "a hundred
thousand."

Quick - imagine a bowl with 10,000 peanuts in it.
How big is the bowl?  Give me a moment and I'll figure
it out -- but that's just it.  I have to figure it
out.  I have no gut sense for how many peanuts is
10,000.

How many mosquitos are in your back yard right now?
Chances are that the answer will either be "none" or
"lots" -- but not something like "roughly 50,000."

> I don't dispute that I see a fundamental distinction
> between 1 of something and a few of something. But
> I see just as fundamental a distinction between a
> few of something and many of something.

The difference, however, is that there is a clear
line between one and not one.  There is no clear line
between a few and many.  You mentioned that four
could be either.  I suspect that the cut off might
also be different for different types of objects.

> If you tell me "there are peanuts in the bowl", you
> mean [B] above and you expect me to understand that
> too. Maybe not chock-full of peanuts, but at least
> enough for me to have a snack. That's supposed to
> be our shared expectation. But I haven't been
> cooperating!

Right, and if you told me that there were chips in
your cupboard which I might be allowed to help myself
to, I'd have a thing or two to say if I came out and
found a bag with just two chips.

   "Hey, Larry, whatdya call this?"
   "Chips, you didn't ask me how many."

> > "Flowers in her hair" does not mean two.
> In fact, I would readily believe that it does.

I think you're right.  At the very least, given
that most women have two ears, the chances that
there are two flowers in her hair is much greater
than the chance that there are two flowers in the
field.

> > "Look for the house with the wild violets"
> > does not mean two violet plants.
>
> Ditto.
> 
> > "We have problems" does not mean two problems.
>
> Ditto.

Ditto meaning that you can understand them to mean
two violets and two problems.  I think that's Literal
Larry again.  Although, let's not sweat these kinds
of details.



> Truly, if I see only one, I am just as likely to
> assume that there are many.

Then perhaps you understand mice better (or worse)
than I do.  If there is a mosquito in your tent,
you swat it.  If there are mosquitos, you put on
bug dope.

> This is true if my relationship with the world is
> such that I deal with one-on-one situations in one
> way and one-on-more-than-one situations in a single
> bimodally different way. I aver that one-on-two
> is more like one-on-one than it is like one-on-100.

Perhaps, but they are also less common.

If I have one peanut, I can show you what a peanut
looks like.  If I have two or ten, I can eat some.
If I have 100, I can share with my friends (unless
I haven't had lunch yet.)

If there is one wolf and we've seen it, we know to
stop looking.  If there are two or 100 wolves and
we see one, we know to keep an eye out for more.
Is this not "a signle bimodally different way"?

And what about binique, trinique and centinique?
Would you really assume, having seen a second Taj
Mahal, that there could not be a third?  More
importantely, why is "unique" a real word, and
"binique" a joke?

Amike salutas,
Thomas/Tomaso ALEXANDER.
www.NightinGael.Net
---Anything below this line is not from Thomas ---

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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