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AUXLANG  June 2006, Week 4

AUXLANG June 2006, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Living without plurals

From:

Rex May <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 24 Jun 2006 11:24:48 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (57 lines)

On Sat, 24 Jun 2006 00:38:56 -0700, Jens Wilkinson <[log in to unmask]> 
wrote:

>--- MacLeod Dave <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>I think the key point with Asian languages, though, is
>that these are not grammatical categories, but rather
>things that can be marked when they need to be marked.
>In Japanese, you do say "gakusei-tachi" to mean
>students, but you don't need to use it when it's not
>necessary. So for example, if you say "Amerikajin no
>gakusei ha Nihonjin no gakusei yori bimbo," it would
>mean that generally speaking, US students are poorer
>than their Japanese counterparts. Although it could
>mean an individual.
>
>Bringing up the situation with the lions, it is true
>that in Japanese, "raion wa kiken" could either mean
>"the lion is dangerous" or "lions are dangerous." But
>it would normally be understood as a general case,
>because to speak of a specific lion, you would
>invariably say "that lion is dangerous."
>
>I wouldn't dream of having an IAL that doesn't give
>you any tools at all to mark plural. What I disagree
>with is the obligatory, grammatical marking of
>singular vs. plural. It should be available when
>wanted, but discardable when not wanted.
>
>Actually, it's the same with gender. It's important to
>be able to specify the gender of a person, but I
>dislike the English use of he vs. she, because when
>you see a baby and want to comment about it, but it's
>parent is insensitive enough to dress it in say yellow
>or green clothes, rather than pink or blue, then I
>always wonder. "What a cute baby. How old is IT?" Or
>should I take a guess, say "he" or "she"? It seems
>silly to me that I have to ask whether it's a boy or a
>girl before being able to talk about it, unless I want
>to be real inventive, and say. "What a cute baby. How
>old is the baby?"

Couldn't agree more, Jens.  My attitude with Ceqli has
been that you can indicate all these things, but you
never _have_ to.  And that applies to tense, too.

There's of course awkwardness all over the place, with
babies, friends, etc. in sex (not gender!), but also with
number:

Everybody put his hat on.  his or her hat on?  their hat
on?  They all sound clumsy.

I like bananas.  Does that mean I don't like _a_ banana by
itself, and I have to have more than one to like them?
Trivial, maybe, but still an awkwardness.

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