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CONLANG  February 2007, Week 2

CONLANG February 2007, Week 2

Subject:

Re: This or that that.

From:

"Mark J. Reed" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 14 Feb 2007 08:25:08 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (103 lines)

I have similar issues with Spanish.  Around Cubans, my accent is
Cuban.  Around Pamplonans, my accent is more Pamplonan (although my
apical /s/ is not quite right).  I don't want my interlocutors to
think I'm mocking them, but it's not intentional - it's just my
automatic accent-improvement mechanism at work.

On 2/14/07, Benct Philip Jonsson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Lars Finsen skrev:
>  > Benct Philip Jonsson wrote:
>  >
>  >> quoting me:
>  >> > You know I have my school English, but I notice that
>  >> > when I stay with some friends that I have on Humberside
>  >> > for a few days, my school English is giving way somehow
>  >> > - to a more real English I suppose.
>  >>
>  >> I also tend to pick up whatever pronunciation those
>  >> around me use, and not only in English, which can be kind
>  >> of embarrassing at times, actually.
>  >
>  > My feeling is that I cannot exactly go about *educating*
>  > those people.
>
> Did I say you should? I think you misunderstood me totally.
> I only said that if you first use one accent when you meet
> people, then suddenly or gradually start aping their accent
> it's embarrassing for me. I do this when I go to different
> German-speaking parts too, or even in Denmark and Norway!
> It's not *their* accent which is embarrassing, but *my*
> failure to maintain the integrity of my own accent(s) in
> different languages. The one exception seems to be when I go
> to Stockholm: my Gothenburg accent gets stronger if
> anything. Probably because Stockholmers react positively to
> it -- quite the opposite of how most Gothenburgers react to
> a Stockholm accent, BTW.
>
>  > They are English, I am not, thus they are "right", and I
>  > am "wrong", aren't they?
>
> Absolutely! I might add that they are right also vis-à-vis
> RP speakers, whose 'betterness' rests only in the (former?)
> social position of its speakers!
>
> The language is their property, to deal with as they like
>  > (and they do), for me it's only a tool. That's the
>  > way it is.
>
> If you'd followed this list in the past you'll find that
> that's precisely my view. It is also my view that foreign
> learners should aim for an accent which
>
> (1) Isn't unduly/unnecessarily influenced by their L2.
> (2) Should pick (a) model accent(s) which are reasonably
>      easy for them to imitate.
> (3) Is easy to comprehend for both L1 and L2 speakers alike.
>
> which to me means that if ones L1 is rhotic and doesn't have
> a lot of diphthongs and doesn't exploit phonemic vowel
> length the same way most British English accents do one may
> be better of taking an American accent as model, unlike what
> the Swedish school system thinks. General American also has
> the advantage that it is relatively free of class
> differences, i.e. in America people of all social classes
> speak the same accent. But of course an L2 learners choice
> of accent model should ultimately be everyones personal
> choice: if you plan to go to Australia to stay there for
> some years you're probably better of learning an Aussie
> accent than anything else, regardless of the phonology of
> your L1! :-)
>
>  > My English also is infected strongly by listening to
>  > various kinds of folk music - currently The Corrie Folk
>  > Trio and Paddie Bell - magnificent stuff...
>
> [@IrIS &nd pr@Ud Qv It] I take it! :-)
>
> An Irish accent BTW has many advantages if you want to be
> widely understood, as it both is rhotic and maintain a
> number of vowel contrasts that were lost in General
> American, as well as a distinct /t/ in all positions. This
> is quite possibly because it originated as Irish speakers'
> L2 accent! The social impact of an Irish accent may be
> another thing, though.
>
>  > LEF
>  >
>  >
>  >
> --
>
> /BP 8^)
> --
>    B.Philip Jonsson mailto:[log in to unmask] (delete X)
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> "Truth, Sir, is a cow which will give [skeptics] no more milk,
> and so they are gone to milk the bull."
>                                      -- Sam. Johnson (no rel. ;)
>


-- 
Mark J. Reed <[log in to unmask]>

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