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AUXLANG  March 2007, Week 5

AUXLANG March 2007, Week 5

Subject:

Re: A thought about Esperanto Verb System

From:

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Reply-To:

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Date:

Fri, 30 Mar 2007 10:05:59 -0400

Content-Type:

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Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (64 lines)

> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wayne S. Rossi

> (This is an interesting point about Esperanto; since
> the preferred method of change is by use, how can one
> be sure that something is a mistake and not an
> attempted reform?)

If enough people keep making the same mistake, it will become a de facto
reform.


> I'd say that the main thing about the Esperanto verb
> that needs reforming is the transitivity / valency of
> verbs. ("La akvo bolas / Mi boligas la akvon.")
> Removing this feature of the language as "proper"
> grammar would affect relatively little, since you
> could still insert "ig" or "igh" if you feel the need
> to be clear about it. Just kick it out and be done
> with it, and the verbs would be much better.

I don't mind the "-ig-"/"-igx-" markers (except esthetically). It's a
little more than just valency because there is a semantic change they
carry too, likewise for the passive. In Sasxsek both of these are
combined into a single suffix "-if" because it really isn't as picky
about valency. Verbs are allowed to be used transitively or
intransitively with the understood shift in meaning. That means "-if"
used with an object means "to cause ~" where without it the meaning is
"to become ~".

sap = to know
sapif = (vt.) to teach, to inform
sapif = (vi.) to learn
sapa = to be known
sapifa = to be taught

I'm still thinking there may be a point in the E-o system because while
this works with there verbs, there's not always clarity in the
derivatives.

sape = one who knows
sapare = knowledge
sapife = teacher, but also learner.

I'm still considering the idea of a distinct "to become" suffix for this
reason.


> (That and the verb "scii." Never, ever, ever will I
> like the pronunciation of that word. And you could
> get around it by expanding the semantic space of
> "koni" or changing the darn thing to something
> pronounceable.)

I agree with the pronunciation part, but I don't like the idea of
merging with "koni". The semantic distinction that many European
languages makes here between knowledge of facts and acquaintance is very
useful. Deu: "wissen"/"kennen", etc...

------------------------------
deinx nxtxr / Dana Nutter

LI SASXSEK LATIS.
http://www.nutter.net/sasxsek

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