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AUXLANG  January 2008, Week 1

AUXLANG January 2008, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Other things we can do besides promoting IALs

From:

Olivier Simon <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 4 Jan 2008 04:07:06 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (95 lines)

[log in to unmask] wrote:
On Behalf Of MacLeod Dave
>>	-vocabulary usage: most people don't know which words in
>their language are shared by others. The average English person
>doesn't know that water is Wasser and book is Buch, that
>international is internazionale and so on. There are also a lot
>of redundant or somewhat overlapping words in each language,
>such as dog and hound and street and road. It would be
>interesting to create a forum with a script that changed what a
>person types in their own language into words that are more
>easily recognized to others when the word is redundant. It would
>make things a bit awkward here and there (since not every dog is
>a hound) but it might be an interesting experiment to see how
>easy it is to read what other people are writing in their own
>language. Some changes to the writing might be possible as well,
>so if a user is registered with English as his native language
>the German Wasser would change to Water, Dutch zon to son and so
>on. On the other hand, a person with German as his native
>language would have a screen that changes English help to helf
>and so on.
>
>To some extent, this is possible but I wouldn't expect it to
>work well beyond a group of related languages.  As you already
>mentioned, there will be issues with  cognate words have
>different meanings in different languages, even if the
>difference is somewhat minor.  The other has to do with inherent
>phonological and morphological differences.  Yes, you could make
>"wasser" into "water", effectively removing the shifts in
>High-German from Low-German, but then you wouldn't have German
>any more.  You'd have really just another dialect of
>Plattdeutsch.  Then I'd also have to ask, why bother with
>"water" as all.  I'd guess "aqua" is more well known.  Then
>you'd have to ask how far back you want to take these language
>mergers. Taken too far you'll end up with PIE.
>
Funny! Sambahsa plays on two fields: Loanwords and inherited vocabulary 
(from IE); For "water", sambahsa has the two IE roots "wed(or)" and "aqua", 
the latter designating water as an element or mineral water. Taking back roots 
works to a certain degree (ex: sambahsa words like "ego", "gnoh", "brater"...) 
but phonological changes can lead to fully different-looking results. It can be 
nevertheless a good idea to add to the grammar of the auxlang some elements 
of historical phonetics. For example, a speaker of sambahsa would not 
recognize at first sight the parsi word "khâbidan", but using the phonetic rules, 
you can reconstruct "swapitum" which corresponds to "swehptum" = "to 
sleep". In any case, the use of widespread loanwords is the best 
recommended for auxlangs. In this way, only by considering "look-alike" words 
(and not phonetic reconstructions), I found 25% of coincidences between 
sambahsa and a list of 700 basic words of Parsi. I've got little free time for the 
moment but portions of the french-sambahsa vocabulary are already available 
on my blog. 

>>	-Promotion of language standardization, languages worth
>learning and bilingualism - if you're of the opinion that the
>languages of the world are eventually going to merge into a big
>creole the best thing to do could be promoting an existing
>creole. Bislama for example is mostly standardized but the
>orthography isn't quite 100% fixed so this is your chance to
>promote the one you think is best (probably the most phonetic
>one), so you could start a website in the language (forums for
>example) that uses the orthography you prefer. Or perhaps the
>best way to promote the language is to improve the economy of
>the country that uses it (so that people have more time to use
>the internet and think about other things besides day to day
>life) so that could mean volunteering to build houses in Vanuatu
>or somewhere. And of course bilingualism never hurts (it's
>usually passed on to your children if you have them) so if
>you're Canadian and haven't learned French yet, that might be a
>good idea too.
>
>Promoting bilingualism works great if everyone is learning the
>same second language.  That's what the whole idea of an auxlang
>is about.  No, I don't really think the languages will merge
>into a big creole.  I see a new crop of regional English-based
>creoles developing over the next couple of generations, and of
>course they will be still be on a continuum with standard
>English.  As time goes onward, standard English will still be
>favored and the creoles will become more like regular English,
>though I'd expect English to pick up.
>
>Just learning any second language really doesn't do much unless
>you are actually in a position to use and exploit your new
>skill.  There's no point in learning French if I'm never going
>to France or any other French-speaking part of the world.  I've
>studied French, mainly because of my interest in languages, but
>rarely have had any real use for it.
>
Don't forget that Internet now offers a lot of opportunities to read and write 
foreign languages. I have never been to any English-speaking country and 
write here in English. I have a few webpages written in German though I 
haven't been anymore to Germany for 16 years. Rien ne vous empêche d'écrire 
vos prochaines interventions en français... 

Olivier
http://sambahsa-mundialect-org.blogspot.com

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