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CONLANG  December 2008, Week 1

CONLANG December 2008, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Random questions about "not" and "and"

From:

Eugene Oh <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 3 Dec 2008 22:08:03 +0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (93 lines)

The confusing elements here are actually the conjunctions, because in
English they have variable distributive properties. In Japanese, for
example, the existence of the gerundive form "-te" eliminates this ambiguity
because the gerundive verb will take the conjugation of the next closest
conjugated verb.
E.g. Mise e itte pan wo kainasai.
Shop to go.GER bread OBJ buy.IMP

Tora wo hanashite kako wo hirakanai de.
tiger OBJ release.GER cage OBJ open.NEG IMP

Cf.

Tora wo hanashite, _soshite_ kako wo hirakanai de.
tiger OBJ release.IMP*, _and_ cage etc.
* the informal imperative is identical to the gerundive (shortened from "-te
kudasai", i.e. gerundive + please)
 = release the tiger, and don't open the cage

Classical Arithide possesses the same property, whereas Dethric has two
forms of each conjunction, one supra-verbal (kan), the other sub-verbal (o).
Meaning, "Do not open the cage _o_ let the tiger out" = English; "do not
open the cage _kan_ let the tiger out" = leave the cage closed but let the
tiger out.

Tangentially, Modern Arithide has three forms of "and" to signify the
different relationships between the two objects/actions on either side, i.e.
whether A is more important than B, less, or equal to it. It also has two
forms of "or", one for a neutral listing and one expecting the listener to
choose the first option.

Eugene

On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 8:19 PM, Gary Shannon <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> While parsing some sentences, it occurred to me that the sentence: "The
> ball is not blue." can be interpreted two different ways:
>
> the ball is-not blue.
> the ball is not-blue.
>
> "is-not" can be treated as a verb (or "not" taken as an adverb), or
> "not-blue" can be treated as an adjective.
>
> I tend to want to interpret "not-blue" as an adjective. Although it does
> complicate sentences like "The ball is not blue OR green" which would have
> to be interpreted as "The ball is not-blue AND not-green." as opposed to
> "The ball is-not blue OR green."
>
> But even "The ball is-not blue OR green." actually means "The ball is-not
> blue AND is-not green." so again, when actually spelled out, the meaning can
> still be interpreted two ways:
>
> "The ball is-not blue OR green." =>
> "The ball is-not blue AND is-not green." OR
> "The ball is not-blue AND is not-green."
>
> Which way do your conlangs handle this?
>
> Another random question about "and":
>
> "Go to the store and buy some bread."
>
> can be interpreted as two commands:
>
> "Go to the store."
> "Buy some bread."
>
> But in the following case, that doesn't work because the two separate
> commands do not convey the intention of the original compound sentence:
>
> "Do not open the cage and let the tiger out."
>
> "Do not open the cage."
> "Let the tiger out."
>
> This implies that "Do not" must be distributed to all the verbs:
>
> "Do not [open the cage and let the tiger out]." =>
> "Do not open the cage."
> "Do not let the tiger out."
>
> But what about:
>
> "Do not let the tiger out and lock the cage before you leave."
>
> Clearly, "Do not" is NOT distributed to both verbs in this case.
>
> How do any of your conlangs address this?
>
> --gary
>

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