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CONLANG Home

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CONLANG  October 2009, Week 3

CONLANG October 2009, Week 3

Subject:

Re: Recycling letters (<: Using <x> as a vowel)

From:

Benct Philip Jonsson <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 21 Oct 2009 16:40:12 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (236 lines)

It just occurred to me that one could do something
similar though less systematic with vowels:

|  i    ui  iu  ue  u   ou  |   / i y   i\  u\  M   u   /
|                           |
|  ei   oi  ie  oe  eu  uo  |   / e 2   @\   8   7   o   /
|                           |
|           e               |        /  @   /
|                           |
|  ai   io  ea  eo  ua  o   |   / E 9   3   3\  V   O   /
|                           |
|  ia       ae              |   / &     6   /
|                           |
|  a    ao          au  oa  |   / a &\          A   Q   /


Clearly many assignments are very arbitrary, and at least
two are hardly more than mnemonics based on English
spelling (I'm not going to reveal how odd my making of
mnemonics works! ;-)

As long as all the diphthongs in the language can
be analysed as a combination of a vowel and one of
the approximants |j w wj| /j w H/ it might work! ;-)

Actually one might even accommodate diphthongs
with a centering offglide if one bends the
analysis a bit and calls the offglide a pharyngeal
approximant /?\_o/, assigns |y| to that sound and
writes /?\/ as |jy|!  Then one could also get
rid of the troublesome, too diphthongy-looking
|oi io ai ia| since [@\@_^ @@_^ 3@_^ 6@_^ 8@_^ 3\@_^ a@_^]
would hardly occur:


|  i    ui  ie  u   iu  ou  |   / i y   i\  u\  M   u   /
|                           |
|  ei   oe  iey ue  eu  uo  |   / e 2   @\   8   7   o   /
|                           |
|           e               |        /  @   /
|                           |
|  ea   eo  ey  uey ua  o   |   / E 9   3   3\  V   O   /
|                           |
|  ae       ay              |   / &     6   /
|                           |
|  a    ao          au  oa  |   / a &\          A   Q   /


A way to write a lot of sounds in ASCII-only
which would be a nightmare to a dyslectic!

/BP


Benct Philip Jonsson skrev:
> Larry Sulky skrev:
>> On Tue, Oct 20, 2009 at 12:22 PM, <deinx nxtxr> 
>> <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
>>
>>> Eric Christopherson wrote:
>>>
>>>  I just discovered Amxrikai Spek in Okrent's book. She doesn't say much
>>>> about it, but I found a few web pages, e.g. <
>>>> http://ial.wikia.com/wiki/Americai_Speak>. The language uses <x> as a
>>>> vowel, along with <c>, <q>, *capital* <A>, Greek alpha, and <o> with 
>>>> a mark
>>>> through it.
>>>>
>>> I remember coming across that language a long time ago on the net. I'd
>>> forgotten about it's unqiue orthography.
>>>
>>>  For some reason I'm fascinated with the idea of <x> for /T/, but I 
>>> don't
>>>> think I would actually use it for that in a conlang. I think I saw a 
>>>> natlang
>>>> use it, but I don't remember which one it was.
>>>>
>>> Unless ASCII compatibility is an issue I favor <þ>.  I can't recall 
>>> seeing
>>> any natlang using <x> for /θ/.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Well, then, how about <x> for /z/ (as in English "xylophone" and "xenon")
>> and <z> for /θ/ (as in Castillian Spanish)?
>>
> 
> IIRC I've seen |x| used for /z/ in proposed orthographies
> for Italian dialects were |z| was /ts/--/dz/.
> 
> If I were to design such an orthography I'd also use
> |sg(i)| for /Z/ if present and |ç| /ts/ to distinguish
> from |z| /dz/.  Alternatively one could then use
> |sç| /S/ and |sz| /Z/ if these occur finally.
> 
> ****
> 
> Before falling asleep yesterday I came up with a wacky
> idea for a system based on the Hungarian type of digraph
> which inherits the manner of articulation from the first
> component letter and the point of articulation from the
> second component letter:
> 
> * Starred items are affricates!
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>         Vcl     Vcd     Vcl     Vcd     (Vcd)   (Vcd)
>         stop*   stop*   fric.   fric.   nasal   liquid
> ------  ------  ------  ------  ------  ------  ---------
> Bilab   p       bp      fv      v       m       rv
> 
> LabDnt  pb      b       f       vf      mb
> 
> Dental  tz      dz      sz      z       nz      lz
> 
> Dental  cz*     xz*
> 
> Alveo   t       dt      sc      zc      n       r l
> 
> Alveo   c*      xc*
> 
> Retro   td      d       s       zs      nd      rd ld
> 
> PalAlv  cs*     xs*     s       zs
> 
> AlvPal  cx*     x*      sx      zx
> 
> Palat   qj      gj      kj      j       nj      lj
> 
> Velar   qk      g       k       jg      ng      lg
> 
> Uvular  q       gq      kq      jq      nq      rq
> 
> Phar                    hy      y
> 
> Epiglt  qy      gy
> 
> Glott   qh              h       yh
> 
> 
> As can be seen I assume that no language distinguishes
> between palatoalveolar and retroflex fricatives and
> affricates.  The fact that such sounds are acoustically
> practically identical makes this assumption pretty safe.
> 
> If there is distinctive consonant length in the
> language this can be expressed like in Hungarian
> by doubling the first letter of each digraph.
> 
> If there exist non-homorganic fricative + affricate
> combos in the language some creative cludges would
> have to be used:  |sscc| /Sts/ |zzxx| /Ddz\/.
> 
> OTOH if nasals are always homorganic with a following
> obstruent some optimizations could be made:
> 
> |  mp   mbp mfv mv  |   /mp     mb      mP      mB/
> |  mpb  mbb mf  mvf |   /m\q_p  m\d_b   m\f     m\v/
> |  ntz  ndz nsz nz  |   /n_dn_t n_dd_d  n_dT    n_dD/
> |  nt   ndt nsc nzc |   /nt     nd      ns      nz/
> |  ntd  nd  ns  nzs |   /n`t`   n`d`    n`s`    n`s`/
> |  nqj  ngj nkj njj |   /Jc     JJ\     JC      Jj/
> |  nqk  ngg ngk njk |   /Nk     Ng      Nx      NG/
> |  nqq  ngq nkq njq |   /N\q    N\G\    N\X     N\R/
> 
> These could largely be retained even if /J/ could
> occur before velars and uvulars, in which case
> these spellings could be used to disambiguate:
> 
> |   njk     njjk    nnjk    njq     njjq    nnjq    |
> /   Jx      JG      NG      Jq      JR\     N\R\    /
> 
> Thus |ngjk| can still be /JJ\x/ and |nqjq| can be /Jcq/
> if needed,  and |nnjjk| for /NGG/ and |nnjjq| /N\R\R\/
> can be used, as can |nnqq| /N\qq/ and |nngg| /Ngg/.
> Possibly |nnqj| /Jc/ vs. |nqj| /N\j/ might also be needed.
> 
>  so that spelling triplets like
> |rq rqq rrq| /R Rq rq/ can be used.
> 
> Assuming that the language does not allow
> long consonants before or after other consonants
> one could have a spelling rule that an homorganic
> nasal or liquid can be expressed as |nn ll rr|
> before any consonant;  where this clashes with
> the rule of doubling only the first letter of digraphs
> to express gemination both letters can be doubled
> to express sonorant + consonant:
> 
> |rrv| /B\:/     |rvv| /rB/      |rrvv| /B\B/*
> |nnz| /n_d:/    |nzz| /nD/*     |nnzz| /n_dD/
> |llz| /l_d:/    |lzz| /lD/*     |llzz| /l_dD/
> |nnd| /n`:/     |ndd| /nd`/*    |nndd| /n`d`/
> |rrd| /r\`:/    |rdd| /rd`/*    |rrdd| /r\`d`/
> |lld| /l`:/     |ldd| /ld`/*    |lldd| /l`d`/
> |nnj| /J:/?     |njj| /nj/?     |nnjj| /Jj/?
> |llj| /L:/?     |ljj| /lj/?     |lljj| /Lj/?
> |nng| /N:/      |ngg| /ng/*     |nngg| /Ng/
> |llg| /L\:/     |lgg| /lg/?     |llgg| /Lg/?
> |nnq| /N\:/     |nqq| /nq/*     |nnqq| /N\q/
> |rrq| /R\:/     |rqq| /rq/      |rrqq| /rq/
> 
> Clearly the items starred above are unlikely to
> occur, and the queried items in each row are unlikely to
> contrast with  each other in most languages,
> so for most rows the |RRCC| column can be factored out:
> 
> |rrv| /B\:/     |rvv| /rB/
> |nnz| /n_d:/    |nzz| /n_dD/
> |llz| /l_d:/    |lzz| /l_dD/
> |nnd| /n`:/     |ndd| /n`d`/
> |rrd| /r\`:/    |rdd| /r\`d`/
> |lld| /l`:/     |ldd| /l`d`/
> |nnj| /J:/
> |llj| /L:/
> |nng| /N:/      |ngg| /Ng/
> |llg| /L\:/     |lgg| /lg/--/Lg/
> |nnq| /N\:/     |nqq| /N\q/
> |rrq| /R\:/     |rqq| /rq/      |rrqq| /rq/
> 
> Unfortunately /rq/ and /R\q/ are likely to be
> contrastive in any language which has all three
> phonemes.
> 
> A last minute thought:  perhaps one could avoid
> the nastish |gq| by having
> 
> Velar   qk      gk      k       jk      nk      lk
> 
> Uvular  q       g       kq      jq      nq      rq
> 
> Of course one could then have |ng| /N\/ but that would
> somehow feel strange! :-)
> 
> /BP 8^)>

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June 2008, Week 4
June 2008, Week 3
June 2008, Week 2
June 2008, Week 1
May 2008, Week 5
May 2008, Week 4
May 2008, Week 3
May 2008, Week 2
May 2008, Week 1
April 2008, Week 5
April 2008, Week 4
April 2008, Week 3
April 2008, Week 2
April 2008, Week 1
March 2008, Week 5
March 2008, Week 4
March 2008, Week 3
March 2008, Week 2
March 2008, Week 1
February 2008, Week 5
February 2008, Week 4
February 2008, Week 3
February 2008, Week 2
February 2008, Week 1
January 2008, Week 5
January 2008, Week 4
January 2008, Week 3
January 2008, Week 2
January 2008, Week 1
December 2007, Week 5
December 2007, Week 4
December 2007, Week 3
December 2007, Week 2
December 2007, Week 1
November 2007, Week 5
November 2007, Week 4
November 2007, Week 3
November 2007, Week 2
November 2007, Week 1
October 2007, Week 5
October 2007, Week 4
October 2007, Week 3
October 2007, Week 2
October 2007, Week 1
September 2007, Week 5
September 2007, Week 4
September 2007, Week 3
September 2007, Week 2
September 2007, Week 1
August 2007, Week 5
August 2007, Week 4
August 2007, Week 3
August 2007, Week 2
August 2007, Week 1
July 2007, Week 5
July 2007, Week 4
July 2007, Week 3
July 2007, Week 2
July 2007, Week 1
June 2007, Week 5
June 2007, Week 4
June 2007, Week 3
June 2007, Week 2
June 2007, Week 1
May 2007, Week 5
May 2007, Week 4
May 2007, Week 3
May 2007, Week 2
May 2007, Week 1
April 2007, Week 5
April 2007, Week 4
April 2007, Week 3
April 2007, Week 2
April 2007, Week 1
March 2007, Week 5
March 2007, Week 4
March 2007, Week 3
March 2007, Week 2
March 2007, Week 1
February 2007, Week 4
February 2007, Week 3
February 2007, Week 2
February 2007, Week 1
January 2007, Week 5
January 2007, Week 4
January 2007, Week 3
January 2007, Week 2
January 2007, Week 1
December 2006, Week 5
December 2006, Week 4
December 2006, Week 3
December 2006, Week 2
December 2006, Week 1
November 2006, Week 5
November 2006, Week 4
November 2006, Week 3
November 2006, Week 2
November 2006, Week 1
October 2006, Week 5
October 2006, Week 4
October 2006, Week 3
October 2006, Week 2
October 2006, Week 1
September 2006, Week 5
September 2006, Week 4
September 2006, Week 3
September 2006, Week 2
September 2006, Week 1
August 2006, Week 5
August 2006, Week 4
August 2006, Week 3
August 2006, Week 2
August 2006, Week 1
July 2006, Week 5
July 2006, Week 4
July 2006, Week 3
July 2006, Week 2
July 2006, Week 1
June 2006, Week 5
June 2006, Week 4
June 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 2
June 2006, Week 1
May 2006, Week 5
May 2006, Week 4
May 2006, Week 3
May 2006, Week 2
May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 5
April 2006, Week 4
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 5
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3
March 2006, Week 2
March 2006, Week 1
February 2006, Week 4
February 2006, Week 3
February 2006, Week 2
February 2006, Week 1
January 2006, Week 5
January 2006, Week 4
January 2006, Week 3
January 2006, Week 2
January 2006, Week 1
December 2005, Week 5
December 2005, Week 4
December 2005, Week 3
December 2005, Week 2
December 2005, Week 1
November 2005, Week 5
November 2005, Week 4
November 2005, Week 3
November 2005, Week 2
November 2005, Week 1
October 2005, Week 5
October 2005, Week 4
October 2005, Week 3
October 2005, Week 2
October 2005, Week 1
September 2005, Week 5
September 2005, Week 4
September 2005, Week 3
September 2005, Week 2
September 2005, Week 1
August 2005, Week 5
August 2005, Week 4
August 2005, Week 3
August 2005, Week 2
August 2005, Week 1
July 2005, Week 5
July 2005, Week 4
July 2005, Week 3
July 2005, Week 2
July 2005, Week 1
June 2005, Week 5
June 2005, Week 4
June 2005, Week 3
June 2005, Week 2
June 2005, Week 1
May 2005, Week 5
May 2005, Week 4
May 2005, Week 3
May 2005, Week 2
May 2005, Week 1
April 2005, Week 5
April 2005, Week 4
April 2005, Week 3
April 2005, Week 2
April 2005, Week 1
March 2005, Week 5
March 2005, Week 4
March 2005, Week 3
March 2005, Week 2
March 2005, Week 1
February 2005, Week 4
February 2005, Week 3
February 2005, Week 2
February 2005, Week 1
January 2005, Week 5
January 2005, Week 4
January 2005, Week 3
January 2005, Week 2
January 2005, Week 1
December 2004, Week 5
December 2004, Week 4
December 2004, Week 3
December 2004, Week 2
December 2004, Week 1
November 2004, Week 5
November 2004, Week 4
November 2004, Week 3
November 2004, Week 2
November 2004, Week 1
October 2004, Week 5
October 2004, Week 4
October 2004, Week 3
October 2004, Week 2
October 2004, Week 1
September 2004, Week 5
September 2004, Week 4
September 2004, Week 3
September 2004, Week 2
September 2004, Week 1
August 2004, Week 5
August 2004, Week 4
August 2004, Week 3
August 2004, Week 2
August 2004, Week 1
July 2004, Week 5
July 2004, Week 4
July 2004, Week 3
July 2004, Week 2
July 2004, Week 1
June 2004, Week 5
June 2004, Week 4
June 2004, Week 3
June 2004, Week 2
June 2004, Week 1
May 2004, Week 5
May 2004, Week 4
May 2004, Week 3
May 2004, Week 2
May 2004, Week 1
April 2004, Week 5
April 2004, Week 4
April 2004, Week 3
April 2004, Week 2
April 2004, Week 1
March 2004, Week 5
March 2004, Week 4
March 2004, Week 3
March 2004, Week 2
March 2004, Week 1
February 2004, Week 5
February 2004, Week 4
February 2004, Week 3
February 2004, Week 2
February 2004, Week 1
January 2004, Week 5
January 2004, Week 4
January 2004, Week 3
January 2004, Week 2
January 2004, Week 1
December 2003, Week 5
December 2003, Week 4
December 2003, Week 3
December 2003, Week 2
December 2003, Week 1
November 2003, Week 5
November 2003, Week 4
November 2003, Week 3
November 2003, Week 2
November 2003, Week 1
October 2003, Week 5
October 2003, Week 4
October 2003, Week 3
October 2003, Week 2
October 2003, Week 1
September 2003, Week 5
September 2003, Week 4
September 2003, Week 3
September 2003, Week 2
September 2003, Week 1
August 2003, Week 5
August 2003, Week 4
August 2003, Week 3
August 2003, Week 2
August 2003, Week 1
July 2003, Week 5
July 2003, Week 4
July 2003, Week 3
July 2003, Week 2
July 2003, Week 1
June 2003, Week 5
June 2003, Week 4
June 2003, Week 3
June 2003, Week 2
June 2003, Week 1
May 2003, Week 5
May 2003, Week 4
May 2003, Week 3
May 2003, Week 2
May 2003, Week 1
April 2003, Week 5
April 2003, Week 4
April 2003, Week 3
April 2003, Week 2
April 2003, Week 1
March 2003, Week 5
March 2003, Week 4
March 2003, Week 3
March 2003, Week 2
March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
February 2003, Week 3
February 2003, Week 2
February 2003, Week 1
January 2003, Week 5
January 2003, Week 4
January 2003, Week 3
January 2003, Week 2
January 2003, Week 1
December 2002, Week 5
December 2002, Week 4
December 2002, Week 3
December 2002, Week 2
December 2002, Week 1
November 2002, Week 5
November 2002, Week 4
November 2002, Week 3
November 2002, Week 2
November 2002, Week 1
October 2002, Week 5
October 2002, Week 4
October 2002, Week 3
October 2002, Week 2
October 2002, Week 1
September 2002, Week 5
September 2002, Week 4
September 2002, Week 3
September 2002, Week 2
September 2002, Week 1
August 2002, Week 5
August 2002, Week 4
August 2002, Week 3
August 2002, Week 2
August 2002, Week 1
July 2002, Week 5
July 2002, Week 4
July 2002, Week 3
July 2002, Week 2
July 2002, Week 1
June 2002, Week 5
June 2002, Week 4
June 2002, Week 3
June 2002, Week 2
June 2002, Week 1
May 2002, Week 5
May 2002, Week 4
May 2002, Week 3
May 2002, Week 2
May 2002, Week 1
April 2002, Week 5
April 2002, Week 4
April 2002, Week 3
April 2002, Week 2
April 2002, Week 1
March 2002, Week 5
March 2002, Week 4
March 2002, Week 3
March 2002, Week 2
March 2002, Week 1
February 2002, Week 4
February 2002, Week 3
February 2002, Week 2
February 2002, Week 1
January 2002, Week 5
January 2002, Week 4
January 2002, Week 3
January 2002, Week 2
January 2002, Week 1
December 2001, Week 5
December 2001, Week 4
December 2001, Week 3
December 2001, Week 2
December 2001, Week 1
November 2001, Week 5
November 2001, Week 4
November 2001, Week 3
November 2001, Week 2
November 2001, Week 1
October 2001, Week 5
October 2001, Week 4
October 2001, Week 3
October 2001, Week 2
October 2001, Week 1
September 2001, Week 5
September 2001, Week 4
September 2001, Week 3
September 2001, Week 2
September 2001, Week 1
August 2001, Week 5
August 2001, Week 4
August 2001, Week 3
August 2001, Week 2
August 2001, Week 1
July 2001, Week 5
July 2001, Week 4
July 2001, Week 3
July 2001, Week 2
July 2001, Week 1
June 2001, Week 5
June 2001, Week 4
June 2001, Week 3
June 2001, Week 2
June 2001, Week 1
May 2001, Week 5
May 2001, Week 4
May 2001, Week 3
May 2001, Week 2
May 2001, Week 1
April 2001, Week 5
April 2001, Week 4
April 2001, Week 3
April 2001, Week 2
April 2001, Week 1
March 2001, Week 5
March 2001, Week 4
March 2001, Week 3
March 2001, Week 2
March 2001, Week 1
February 2001, Week 4
February 2001, Week 3
February 2001, Week 2
February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
January 2001, Week 4
January 2001, Week 3
January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
December 2000, Week 4
December 2000, Week 3
December 2000, Week 2
December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
November 2000, Week 4
November 2000, Week 3
November 2000, Week 2
November 2000, Week 1
October 2000, Week 5
October 2000, Week 4
October 2000, Week 3
October 2000, Week 2
October 2000, Week 1
September 2000, Week 5
September 2000, Week 4
September 2000, Week 3
September 2000, Week 2
September 2000, Week 1
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August 2000, Week 4
August 2000, Week 3
August 2000, Week 2
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July 2000, Week 3
July 2000, Week 2
July 2000, Week 1
June 2000, Week 5
June 2000, Week 4
June 2000, Week 3
June 2000, Week 2
June 2000, Week 1
May 2000, Week 5
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May 2000, Week 2
May 2000, Week 1
April 2000, Week 5
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April 2000, Week 3
April 2000, Week 2
April 2000, Week 1
March 2000, Week 5
March 2000, Week 4
March 2000, Week 3
March 2000, Week 2
March 2000, Week 1
February 2000, Week 5
February 2000, Week 4
February 2000, Week 3
February 2000, Week 2
February 2000, Week 1
January 2000, Week 5
January 2000, Week 4
January 2000, Week 3
January 2000, Week 2
January 2000, Week 1
December 1999, Week 5
December 1999, Week 4
December 1999, Week 3
December 1999, Week 2
December 1999, Week 1
November 1999, Week 5
November 1999, Week 4
November 1999, Week 3
November 1999, Week 2
November 1999, Week 1
October 1999, Week 5
October 1999, Week 4
October 1999, Week 3
October 1999, Week 2
October 1999, Week 1
September 1999, Week 5
September 1999, Week 4
September 1999, Week 3
September 1999, Week 2
September 1999, Week 1
August 1999, Week 5
August 1999, Week 4
August 1999, Week 3
August 1999, Week 2
August 1999, Week 1
July 1999, Week 5
July 1999, Week 4
July 1999, Week 3
July 1999, Week 2
July 1999, Week 1
June 1999, Week 5
June 1999, Week 4
June 1999, Week 3
June 1999, Week 2
June 1999, Week 1
May 1999, Week 5
May 1999, Week 4
May 1999, Week 3
May 1999, Week 2
May 1999, Week 1
April 1999, Week 5
April 1999, Week 4
April 1999, Week 3
April 1999, Week 2
April 1999, Week 1
March 1999, Week 5
March 1999, Week 4
March 1999, Week 3
March 1999, Week 2
March 1999, Week 1
February 1999, Week 5
February 1999, Week 4
February 1999, Week 3
February 1999, Week 2
February 1999, Week 1
January 1999, Week 5
January 1999, Week 4
January 1999, Week 3
January 1999, Week 2
January 1999, Week 1
December 1998, Week 5
December 1998, Week 4
December 1998, Week 3
December 1998, Week 2
December 1998, Week 1
November 1998, Week 5
November 1998, Week 4
November 1998, Week 3
November 1998, Week 2
November 1998, Week 1
October 1998, Week 5
October 1998, Week 4
October 1998, Week 3
October 1998, Week 2
October 1998, Week 1
September 1998, Week 5
September 1998, Week 4
September 1998, Week 3

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