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CONLANG  June 2010, Week 4

CONLANG June 2010, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Special characters in orthography [WAS Re: ¡gla ði midjar festë!]

From:

Dana Nutter <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 23 Jun 2010 13:13:39 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (71 lines)

On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 5:33 PM, Edgard Bikelis <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>> Feedback?
>>>
>>> Here's the current orthography, a simple 1:1 grapheme:phoneme system.
>>>
>>> < a b c d ð e ə f g h ħ i j ɉ k l m n ŋ o p q r s š t þ u v w y z ž >
>>> / a b ʧ d ð e ə f g h x i j ʤ k l m n ŋ o p ɣ ʀ s ʃ t þ u v w ɨ z ʒ /
>
> Why not <x> for /x/?

It got displaced somewhere in the initial romanization.  Actually /x/
was originally <c>, but there have been some shufflings since then.
Each character has an ASCII alternative.  <x> is the alternate for
schwa. Most of the others are just digraphs made by doubling (ex: <dd>
= <ð>) but I don't want to do that for vowels because they are so
common.


> I would reaccommodate some correspondences, so that you don't need <ɉ>:
>
> /ə/ could be <ë>... the capital schwa is quite ugly;

That is one of it's ASCII/XASCII alternative forms but the schwa it
the proper form.  "Ugly" is of course subjective.

> <j> for /ʤ/, and
> <y> for /j/, and
> <ï> for /ɨ/ (/ə/ is to /e/ almost as /ɨ/ is to /i/).

<y> fits better given the etymologies of most of the vocabulary.   The
affricates like /ʤ/ are fairly rare phonemes, only occuring in
"recent" (there is some sort of bogus history for the lexicon) loans
from certain languages, and the plural suffix <-yɉ>.  In Classic Deini
the glyphs are almost like ligatures.  Classic Deini used the same
glyph for [i] and [j] as they are considered allophones but "Modern
Deini" (=romanized) now uses a dinstinct symbol <j> before or between
other vowels.


> Yogh is a very good idea... so it would be:
>
> / a b ʧ d ð e ə f g ɣ h i ɨ ʤ k l m n ŋ o p ʀ s ʃ t þ u v w x j z ʒ /
> < a b c d ð e ë f g ȝ h i ï j k l m n ŋ o p r s š t þ u v w x y z ž >

I like it but I don't.  I don't mind unusual characters but I need to
balance out the ease of typing and displaying certain characters too.
Actually I'd have preferred to keep the Classic script but abandoned
it because of machinability concerns.


> Capital eng isn't great either, but <ṅ> wouldn't be much better, and
> it would add another diacritic...

I like eng <ŋ>, at least the lowercase form which is an <n> with the
hook of <g> tacked on.  Seems intuitive from my perspective.  I'm not
a big fan of diactrics but do prefer them to digraphs, especially when
reading or writing by hand.  For typing I do find the digraphs easier.


> Anyhow, I feel it would give a pleasant reading, and you?

Well, /ɣ/ was the only phoneme I was really bringing up, mainly
because I look at words like "daq" [daɣ] (="day") and the <q> just
doesn't look "right" in my own mind for what I'm trying to do.   My
leanings right now are to make it G-hacek, and retain <q> as it's
ASCII alternative form.  Maybe I should sit and write out some sample
texts with the alternatives until one of them feels right.  The
phoneme itself occurs mostly in final or medial positions.

    daǧ  /  daǥ  /  daq  /  daȝ

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