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CONLANG Home

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CONLANG  November 2010, Week 2

CONLANG November 2010, Week 2

Subject:

Re: tonogenesis rides again

From:

Alex Fink <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 12 Nov 2010 17:48:33 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (79 lines)

On Wed, 10 Nov 2010 14:50:07 -0500, Matthew Boutilier <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>i have some ideas for tonogenesis.  they aren't the standard voiceless cons.
>> high tone, etc., but i think they're plausible so i thought i would
>shamelessly post them and hope for comments.
>
>in chronological order (if it matters; also, i'm using the pinyin numbers
>for simplicity):

Something more compositional (e.g. _H _LH _L _HL) is simpler, and far far
more transparent, if admittedly longer.  I hereby give you a friendly push
in that direction.

>1) V: > V_1
>e.g. lo:kam > lo1kam
>basically, vowel length ceases to be phonemic (chronemic) and long vowels
>are realized as ones with *high *pitch
>
>2) VCVCV > V_4CCV
>e.g. todumag > to4dmag ( > to4zma )
>the syncope rule: wherever syncope occurs, the preceding vowel "compensates"
>(to use a sufficiently vague term) by developing *falling* tone
>
>3) VS > V_2
>(S = semivowel)
>e.g. pelwoi > pelwo2
>basically, falling diphthongs become pure vowels with *rising* tone.  yeah,
>i know diphthongs =/= vowel+semivowel but here the difference is trivial
>enough.
>
>[4) none of the above - which will apply for most of the syllables in a big
>word, and most monosyllabic words - implies no tone, or neutral tone, or
>whatever.]

On reading this, this was the first variation / analysis that came to my
mind, one where the length distinction wasn't lost.  Short vowels are one
mora, long are two.  Each mora is unmarked (= low) or high; every long vowel
has to have at least one high mora, and both may be high at once; short
vowels cannot have high morae.  Which I think is a fine system, and more
likely to explain why things would come about this sort of way.  (Of course,
you could then take my system and lose length but retain the pitches.)

The flavour of this reminds me of the Slavic accentual developments. 
Someone else here can probably recommend a better place to read about them
-- I was somehow cowed by most treatments I bumped into until finding Geoff
Eddy's take on them for a Latin-to-Slavic bogolang:
  http://sleepingsages.com/kalinin/GeoffEddy/bogo.html
but I guess the first place I'd point (besides WP) is 
  http://www.kortlandt.nl/publications/art066e.pdf

>thoughts?  does this make any sense whatsoever?  should 2) and 3) be
>reversed?  wiki, fount of all knowledge, says that falling diphthongs often
>have higher pitch on the more prominent first element ... but how universal
>does this have to be?

To generalise a bit what Roger's been saying, the basic principle is that
the prominent element receives the prominent tone (usually high, but it can
be low), and the non-prominent tones on deleted elements accrete onto it and
make contours.  

Your basic problem, at this level, is that both changes (2) and (3) have the
first of two tone-bearing units survive (*V*CV and *V*G resp.), so they
should both turn out prominent-tone-first.  

If you don't want them to merge, my best advice is to turn one of them to HL
(perhaps (3)), then do some shifts in the tone system, then turn the other
one ((2)) to HL now that the old HL is out of the way.  Perhaps like this;
this switches the outcomes of (1) and (2) but my gut feeling is it's more
plausible that way.  [View in fixed pitch.]

  V:      VCV     VG      protolang
  V_HH    VCV     V_HL    first tonogenesis       
  V_H^    VCV     V_HH    tone shifts stage 1: raise second elements
                          (^ means extra-high)
  V_LH    VCV     V_HH    tone shifts stage 2: lower the H^ unit as a whole
  V_LH    V_HL C  V_HH    second tonogenesis

Alex

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