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CONLANG  November 2011, Week 3

CONLANG November 2011, Week 3

Subject:

Re: Searching for a poetic form

From:

Padraic Brown <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 16 Nov 2011 14:11:09 -0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (134 lines)

This sestina reminds me a bit of change ringing. You know, where they ring
bells in a certain order, then alternate the order forming different
permutations of the same set of tones. In the case of sestina, you're
picking six words, "ringing them" in the desired order and then alternating
the order. The main difference is the spoken poem has extra filler around
the six primary words that serve to make sense.

Padraic

--- On Wed, 11/16/11, Leland Kusmer <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> From: Leland Kusmer <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: [CONLANG] Searching for a poetic form
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Date: Wednesday, November 16, 2011, 2:02 PM
> I'm not sure where the sestina form
> fits in your list of parameters – it
> determines actual words used, so isn't quite rhyme. Also
> consider acrostic,
> where the first letters of the lines spell a word. (This is
> a form much
> used in ASL poetry – basically, forming a pattern among
> the handshapes of
> successive words, either having them spell a word in
> English or having them
> simply follow a known pattern, like a segment of the
> alphabet or the
> integers.)
> 
> Luc bat looks awesome! Thanks for finding that.
> 
> On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 1:50 PM, Adam Walker <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> 
> > Interesting.  I'll look at that one.  I just
> learned about Burmese yada
> > which uses something called climbing rhyme where the
> rhymed words drift
> > backward through succeeding lines.  And luc bat
> is an interesting
> > Vietnamese form.  Though both of these depend on
> rhyme in some form.
> >
> > So far it looks like poetry depends on one or some
> comination of the
> > following:
> >
> > rhyme -- ending words the same
> > alliteration -- begining word the same
> > parallelism -- contrasting/comparing ideas
> > syllable counting
> > stress or tone paterning
> >
> > Are there other structures?
> >
> > Adam
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:39 PM, Leland Kusmer
> > <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
> >
> > > The oddest poetic form I've ever encountered in
> English is the
> > sestina[0],
> > > which prescribes not rhymes but literally the
> words used to end each
> > line –
> > > the final words of the lines in the first stanza
> must reappear as the
> > final
> > > words of the lines in the later stanzas (but in a
> strictly defined
> > changing
> > > order). Examples that I've seen in English often
> feel free to substitute
> > > either homophones or differently-inflected forms;
> this could be really
> > > interesting in a highly inflected language (where
> only the word *root*
> > must
> > > recur). It could also be interesting to create
> other patterns
> > > of recurrence, or to integrate line-internal
> constraints of some sort.
> > >
> > > -Leland
> > >
> > > [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sestina
> > >
> > > On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 1:11 PM, Adam Walker
> <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> > > > I'm doing NaNoWriMo this year (first time
> for me) and my novel already
> > > > includes bits of Tvern El, Trelkairni,
> B-G-2-3 (after a fasion),
> > > Grravgaaln
> > > > and English heavily laced with Fthsaisthf
> idioms.  Now I am preparing
> > to
> > > > compose a poem that will be rather important
> to the plot, though I
> > > haven't
> > > > decided which charcater will get to speak
> the poem (and thus haven't
> > > chosen
> > > > the language in which to compose it) but I
> want to use a, well exotic
> > for
> > > > lack of better term, poetic *form*.  I
> am familiar with rhymed verse,
> > > > metered (blank) verse, free verse,
> alliterative verse,  parallelism,
> > > haiku,
> > > > and know that Somali verse includes some
> rather arcarne internal
> > > > constraints that I can't recall the
> operation of atm, but I'm sure
> > there
> > > > must be other poetic forms out there that
> would be managable, but quite
> > > > strange to a standard average reader of
> SF.  Does any one have
> > > suggestions
> > > > for forms I should research?
> > > >
> > > > Thankees all around in advance
> > > >
> > > > Adam
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 

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