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CONLANG  April 2012, Week 1

CONLANG April 2012, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Terminology for Non-native Natives

From:

Тоłе МаьіЛеƒіљ МаьіПані <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 6 Apr 2012 20:39:22 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (82 lines)

Aren't you and your fiancee the glossarchs of Mev Pailom?

On 06.04.2012 20:21, Logan Kearsley wrote:
> On 5 April 2012 02:28, BPJ<[log in to unmask]>  wrote:
>> On 2012-04-05 02:59, Daniel Bowman wrote:
>>> How about "urspeaker". Also brings a nice Babel-textish sound to it.
>> What, then, about "original speaker" rather than a macaronic
>> coinage?
> I had to look that up! (macaronic) Congratulations, that doesn't
> happen very often&  I like learning new words.
>
>> Two things to note:
>>
>> 1.  You (Logan) might reverse the meaning of
>>     "native speaker": you and your fiancée weren't
>>     native with the language, but the language is
>>     native with you two in the sense that you are
>>     the language's parents!
> Eh... that's a stretch. My aim with the documentation is to produce
> something in an academic, _Describing Morphosyntax_ style, so I'd like
> to avoid using standard terminology in non-standard ways. Hence asking
> about terminology in the first place.
>
>> 2.  You *can* be a native speaker of more than one language.
> True, but were my fiancee a native multilingual, our total list of
> native languages would still not include one that only began to come
> into existence 5 months ago!
>
> On 5 April 2012 03:55, Jim Henry<[log in to unmask]>  wrote:
>> On 4/4/12, Logan Kearsley<[log in to unmask]>  wrote:
>>> to refer to a person whose speech is considered canonical for the
>>> language. I've started using "canonical speaker" as a placeholder
>>> term, but I wonder if there is some other existing terminology for
>>> this sort of thing.
>> For some conlangs with a speaker community, I refer to "fluent speaker
>> intiution" rather than "native speaker intuition", even if the speaker
>> community in question does have some native speakers, like that of
>> Esperanto -- their judgement isn't necessarily weightier than that of
>> other fluent speakers.  I'm guessing Mev Pailom is too new for you and
>> your fiancée to be fluent in it yet, though.
> Yup. I sadly cannot learn a new language in only 5 months of sporadic
> usage, especially when it's still under construction during the
> learning process.
>
>> "canonical speaker" and
>> "original speaker" both sound good to me.
> "Original speaker" captures a different sense for me. I'm looking for
> something that is a superset of "native speaker", including "fluent
> speakers" in the Esperanto-community sense- a word for the set of all
> people whose performance is exemplary of definitional of correctness.
>
> Here's a collection of things suggested so far, and what they seem to mean:
>
> Native speaker - we all know that one
> Canonical speaker - my coinage for someone whose usage defines correctness
> Primorator == Original speaker == Founding speaker - one of the first
> people to learn / use a language (possibly not the same as the
> creator)
> Language pioneer - same, as far as I can tell from the discussion. One
> of the first to use a new language
> Glossarch - a single person or entity who is authoritative for a
> language. Probably the creator, but not necessarily, if the language
> if the language is inherited or something.
>
> With that breakdown, we could say the canonical speakers of English
> are the native speakers, the canonical speakers of Esperanto are the
> fluent speakers, and the canonical speakers of Mev Pailom are also the
> founding speakers. Meanwhile, the glossarch of gjâ-zym-byn is Jim
> Henry, who is also a founding speaker and a canonical speaker, the
> glossarch of French is the French Academy, made up of native speakers,
> Mev Pailom has no glossarch.
>
> -l.

-- 
Тоłе МаьіЛеƒіљ МаьіПаніљ

Δебјані ҩнІљте Ьлеј
http://illte.conlang.org/ http://delang.conlang.org/
___
«Панемі ƒłе δеьлеј ҩнδеьомеłс» - анƕомі

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