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CONLANG  April 2012, Week 5

CONLANG April 2012, Week 5

Subject:

Re: Indexed Predicates Sketch

From:

neo gu <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 29 Apr 2012 12:47:21 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (63 lines)

On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 10:41:02 -0400, Alex Fink <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Thanks, it looks like you found some holes.

> On Sun, 29 Apr 2012 01:15:01 -0400, neo gu <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> This is the new tense system. It involves temporal intervals as well as temporal points of reference and supercedes what was previously posted about tense.
>>
>> Predicates inheriting points are imperfective while those inheriting intervals are perfective. 
>
> How do you get points?  It looks like you've only introduced one point, o, without the ability to synthesize more.  (Maybe this means only present predicates are imperfective; I guess it could be like that.)

I did have a T operator that synthesized points, but I wasn't sure how it worked, and it looked like I could do without it.

>> The interval of the action x is asserted as being a subrange of the inherited interval:
>>
>>	x0 not less than c0 and x1 not greater than c1
>
> But if a point is inherited, then the interval of the action is asserted as containing that point?

Yes; that needs to be specified.

> And I guess you have no punctuals, grammatically.  

No. Maybe I need to change that??

>> In the absence of an explicitly inherited index, restricted predicates and secondary predicates inherit both the hosts inherited index and its action interval.
>
> I wonder about potential problems with multiple inheritance, if you have a restrictive predicate with two indices.  

It can't have 2 different restrictive arguments, if that's what you mean. Unless of course you have an example.

>>    John-i UPj-o-eat-Di stale-j pancake-j.
>>    "John is eating stale pancakes."
>>
>> The explicitly inherited index is absolute present, which is included in the interval of "eat". The interval of "stale" is a superrange of that of "eat", which is inherited implicitly via index j. 
>
> Why a superrange?  As I read what you've written it sounds like the subrange rule (above) should apply here.  Is the difference between assertives and restrictives also relevant here?

It _should_ be a superrange, because the pancakes are stale before John starts eating them. Shouldn't it? I'm going to have to think more carefully about the restricted predicate inheritance rule.

>> The interval of a depictive secondary predicate is a superrange of that of its host predicate's.
>[...]
>> The starting time of a resultative secondary predicate is the ending time of the host's action.
>
> It looks like there's no morphosyntactic way to tell depictives from resultatives, so I guess you mean this to fall to pragmatics.  

Maybe I could add an inceptive or inchoative (I forget which is which) to the resultative; otherwise, I'd need to use additional link types.

>Hm, I wonder if it'd be natural for this language to have more kinds of secondary predication, corresponding to the other kinds of temporal operators.  If you can have
>"She painted the barn (A-)red" = "she painted the barn such that it _ended up_ being red"
>then why mightn't you have
>"She painted the barn (B-)red" = "she painted the barn such that it _stopped_ being red"?
>
>Alex

I think that might be interpreting the A and B operators too loosely. But the 2nd example might be done using red-NEG:

    Dj-b-paint-Di Ethel-i barn-j red-NEG-Dj.
    "Ethel painted the barn unred."

--

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