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CONLANG  May 2012, Week 1

CONLANG May 2012, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Gender in First Person Singular

From:

Matthew Boutilier <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 1 May 2012 15:29:52 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (80 lines)

> because historically in germanic, ordinal adjectives always take weak
> endings, though that's beside the point.
>

on t'other hand, matt, "erster" and "erste" are strong forms, and what you
said is irrelevant since we're dealing with modern languages. thanks,
other-matt. that's what happens when i reply impulsively from my phone.

the (modern) hebrew example is also (originally) a participial
> construction. _yodea'_ is a masculine adj, _yoda'at_ feminine.
>

to be more precise: the forms are properly:
'ani yodea` = i knowing-MASC
'ani yoda`at' = i knowing-FEM
the forms are indeed participial in origin, from the proto-semitic present
participle shape *pārisum, i.e. *yādi`um (for the masc.) > *yāde`um > *yādē`um
> *yādē` > *yōdē` > Hebrew yōdēa` (epenthetic /a/ introduced between front
vowel and final [former] pharyngeal). compare this to the same shape in
Arabic, kātib "writing(MASC)."
thanks again, other-matt. seriously, don't mention it.

As far as I know, German adjectives are not conjugated for gender nor
> number when in a predicative position, so "I am sad" would be "ich bin *
> traurig*" and "they are sad" would be "sie sind *traurig*".
>

in general -- viz. in most syntactical situations -- that's right. but see
the example with "erste" above. when there's an implicit _the_ (i am _the_
first, second, etc.) the situation differs. and in your example you're not
saying "i'm *the* sad one," but rather "i'm sad."

I took a very basic class in Levantine Arabic, but if I'm not mistaken,
> doesn't Arabic have a lot of instances when you conjugate a verb
> differently based on the gender of whom you're speaking to? That's what I
> can recall of the class.
>

yes. arabic and semitic in general *actually* differentiate two genders
everywhere in the second person -- pronouns, verbs, everywhere. not in the
first person, however. in the first person it's similar to the european
situation, with adjectives (*and*, by virtue of that, *participles*)
inflecting for gender -- Egyptian Arabic: 'ana mrawwa7 "i (masc) am going
home" ; 'ana mrawwa7a "i (fem) am going home."

so *nobody* knows of natlangs that have, say, multiple 1st-person
*pronouns*for multiple genders? i assume that would be confusing as
hell for children
to learn. doesn't japanese do something like this?

wesaþ hale
matt

On Tue, May 1, 2012 at 3:00 PM, Zach Wellstood <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> I took a very basic class in Levantine Arabic, but if I'm not mistaken,
> doesn't Arabic have a lot of instances when you conjugate a verb
> differently based on the gender of whom you're speaking to? That's what I
> can recall of the class.
>
> On Tue, May 1, 2012 at 3:27 PM, Scott Brewer <[log in to unmask]
> >wrote:
>
> > Russian conjugates all past tense verbs according to gender. It stems
> from
> > a participle in Old Church Slavonic, from which Russian evolved.
> >
> > A man would say "Я был" (I was), whereas a woman would say "Я была." Or
> "Я
> > привык" vs. "Я привыкла " (I got used to). It is a common trait in Slavic
> > languages.
> >
>
>
>
> --
> <Say 'Yes' to Conlanging! <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conlang>>
> ra'aalalí 'a!
>

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