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CONLANG  May 2012, Week 2

CONLANG May 2012, Week 2

Subject:

Re: A Brief Random Thought on Verbs

From:

Casey Borders <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 10 May 2012 23:38:48 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (78 lines)

German uses a much broader meaning of the verb to give. For example if you
wanted to know if there were a cinema nearby you would say:

Gibt es ein Kino in der Nähe?
Gives it a cinema in the nearby?

Casey Borders
On May 10, 2012 8:03 PM, "Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets" <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> On 10 May 2012 23:08, Gary Shannon <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> >
> > How have you mapped the semantic space in your conlangs? Are your maps
> > systematic, or did they just happen?
> > --gary
> >
>
> This is something I'm paying a *lot* of attention to for Moten, which is
> why vocabulary building is so slow. As for how it happens, it's a
> combination of conscious design and random chance :) .
>
> For instance, to take your "give" example, in Moten there are two verbs:
> _ja|zi|n_ and _joplej_. They both mean about the same thing: depending on
> which arguments they have, they can mean "give", "take", "get", "receive",
> "put", "bring", etc. Basically, they have a general meaning of "transfer".
> Both have exactly the same meaning, with only a single difference:
> _ja|zi|n_ implies the transfer happens towards the speaker (i.e. from
> listener to speaker or from third-party to listener or speaker), or in a
> way that benefits the speaker, while _joplej_ implies a transfer away from
> the speaker (from the speaker to the listener or a third-party, or from the
> listener to a third-party), or in a way that is detrimental, or at least
> neutral, to the speaker.
>
> Another example is the verb _istu|l_, which means "to call, to summon", but
> can also mean "to bring along". The verb _jeksaj_ means primarily "to
> touch", but it can also be used to mean "to hit, to run into, to meet by
> chance". The verb _jo|zemej_ combines "to eat" and "to drink" (Moten
> doesn't make the distinction between those two). The verb _izgeboj_ means
> "to work on sthg", but also "to tire from sthg" or "to suffer from sthg".
> Those last two meanings are also among the meanings of the verb _igmadevi_,
> but that one means primarily "to get sick because of sthg, to wear off from
> sthg" or even "to kill oneself with sthg".
>
> And then there are verbs that are similar to English ones in terms of
> semantics, but swap the place of the arguments, like _iteo|l_: "to please,
> to be liked by", _jelojmaj_: "to be thought of by", or _jelojmastu|l_: "to
> be remembered by" (yeah, it's a compound of _jelojmaj_ and _istu|l_).
>
> And I can also mention the weird case of "to know", which doesn't have any
> true equivalent in Moten. In Moten, the act of "knowing" something or
> someone is usually indicated by putting the manner by which one came to
> know in the perfect aspect. So if you know something because you studied
> it, you use the perfect of the verb _ivajagi_: "to study, to learn". If you
> know a place because you've been there, you use the perfect of the verb
> _izunlaj_: "to be located". If you know someone because you happened to
> meet them once, you can use the perfect of _jeksaj_ mentioned above. There
> *are* two verbs whose meanings come close to "to know", but they are very
> restricted in their semantics. Those verbs are _|li|n_: "to be aware of" or
> "to know by instinct" and _jolnesi_: "to be an expert in, to know by
> heart".
>
> Something similar happens with "to meet". The verb _jeksaj_ is restricted
> to indicate chance encounters. For planned meetings, one uses instead the
> verb _ipe|laj_: "to see, to look at".
>
> As you can see, Moten does quite interesting things with the semantic
> space, some somewhat similar to what happens in English, some quite wild.
> Some verbs have a wide semantic domain and cover various verbs in English,
> while others only cover a fraction of the semantic space covered by a
> corresponding English verb. And yet, it all feels very natural to me.
> --
> Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets.
>
> http://christophoronomicon.blogspot.com/
> http://www.christophoronomicon.nl/
>

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