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CONLANG  December 2012, Week 4

CONLANG December 2012, Week 4

Subject:

Re: If

From:

"Jacob O." <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 28 Dec 2012 22:42:43 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (62 lines)

On Thu, 27 Dec 2012 03:00:35 -0500, Sai <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Something I kinda enjoy about working on UNLWS[0] w/ Alex Fink is the
>philosophy-of-language-ish parts required.

Unrelated, but noticed your Amazing Grice of a few weeks (?) ago, and it was spot on. 

>One of our longer term projects has been an interpretation of the
>Prayer of St. Francis (which is incidentally the only one I ever
>pray).
>
>The first verse of it has essentially the form "where there is a lack
>of X, may I provide X". This in turn requires expressing "need", which
>we analyze as an "if" — "X needs Y" is really "X is good [in way Z]
>only if Y".
>
>And "if" in turn brings up the issue of hypothetical nonce worlds
>(e.g. "if I were rich, …" creates a discussion where you are talking
>about an alternate world which inherits from this one but has your
>wealth status overriden).
>
>How to do _that_ took us a few months off and on to work out, probably
>a few hours of actual discussion and lots of mulling inbetween.
>
>We finally decided on a solution. It requires a predicate "X is true
>in world Y", a special cartouche which delineates a world, and a
>special pronoun (or predicate?) which references the extant world
>(i.e. a _this_ keyword). (We haven't fixed on forms for those yet.)
>
>Thus, "X if Y" is "in a world defined by Y, X".

I suggest looking at David Lewis' Counterpart Theory. IIRC, he uses quantifiers over ranges of worlds and is able to overcome several of the typical pitfalls of counterfactual thinking. He does, however, fall into other pitfalls--modality is one of those places where every formalization seems to come up unsatisfactory in some way or another. Have you considered having more than one way of doing it?
Anyway, if you're interested, the paper's here. It has a bit of formal logic in it, but hopefully formal logic is so this is one of those problems where any formalizationmet an engelanger has no reason to fear.
http://knoesis.wright.edu/students/topher/courses/phillang/lewis.pdf

Somewhat in line with this, have you considered ways of bracketing out one or more of the Language-Thought-Reality trio? Bracketing reality, for instance, to talk only about the interaction between thought and language, or bracketing language (by treating it as transparent). A non-linear system might be able to more precisely/succinctly express these distinctions by making explicit discursive restrictions. More concretely, Descartes would want to put discussions of reality off-limits because part of his project is _doubting certainty_, which seems downright bizarre unless you can express the modalities of different levels.


>It also turned out to want a revision to our set of articles;
>previously, we had only indefinite and generic (there's no definite
>article, since we do that by direct reference). Now there are two
>more: universal and correlative (e.g. Indians are _correlative_
>phone-center workers — the generic Indian is not one, but they're more
>common than one would expect).
>
>(Another gloss of the correlative article: "being an A is [possibly
>weak] Bayesian evidence for being a B".)

This is damned pragmatic! I think this sort of relational is going on my todo list for next time I get around actually conlanging instead of just language-theorizing. :/

>So though many loglangs love their logical conjunctions, so far we
>don't have any. :-P (OTOH, UNLWS doesn't _set out_ to be a loglang,
>but primarily rather a 2D written language.)

Makes me wonder whether there is a clear way of setting up truth-tables for non-linear logics. (It sounds like a nightmare.)

>Anyway, whee engelangs, making you rethink such basic kinds of things.
>
>- Sai
>
>[0] http://saizai.com/nlws

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