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CONLANG Home

CONLANG Home

CONLANG  January 2014, Week 2

CONLANG January 2014, Week 2

Subject:

Re: Allophones and approximants

From:

BPJ <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

[log in to unmask]

Date:

Wed, 8 Jan 2014 10:43:04 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (50 lines)

So you are looking for *clusters* from which [L] and [5] might arise while
[l] remains in some positions? [L] can of course arise from [lj] and [ll]
can be a source of [5] as in Old French where all lC became 5C and then wC
but [ll] became just [5] > [w]. If you don't have [ll] [ld] and perhaps [lg
gl lb tl dl] might be sources. Old Swedish _litla_ became _lilla_ which IML
is ['le5:A]. OTOH in Romance CL GL TL DL all became [L] but as Italian
shows l > L / C __ V generally there.

/bpj struggling w the gmail app

Den onsdagen den 8:e januarig 2014 skrev Pete.bleackley:

> (I wish I could get top-quoting to work on this phone).
>
> The starting point is KhangaÞyagon, which has a phonology similar to
> English or German. One of the things I want to do to it is simplify
> consonant clusters, and that's a natural source for my new laterals. Once
> they're there, I thought it would be fun to play with them a bit.
>
> Pete
>
> Sent from Samsung Mobile
>
>  Alex Fink <[log in to unmask] <javascript:;>> wrote:
>
> On Tue, 7 Jan 2014 21:17:10 +0000, Pete.bleackley <
> [log in to unmask] <javascript:;>> wrote:
>
> >The ancestor language has /w/ /l/ and /j/ phonemically. One wave of sound
> >changes creates /5/ and /L/ from clusters, and another turns them into
> >allophones of /w/ and /j/ respectively. When the laterals merge, their
> non-
> >lateral allophones are unchanged.
> >
> >That's as much as I've worked out so far.
>
> Do you insist on /5/ and /L/ having phonemic existence before the
> allophonic stage?  That seems considerably more unlikely to me than doing
> it the direct way, creating them in a subphonemic split.  If you were doing
> it out of some sense of necessity, worried it's impossible to get glides to
> spontaneously lateralise without a lateral input, you needn't worry, as it
> can happen: for example Hopi had the change *_w_ > _l_  before a (nonhigh?)
> back vowel.  I think I've seen a similar change for /j/ but can't call one
> to mind now (except that Jeff Burke used it in his Central Mountain family
> and presumably had an antecedent in mind), but Arapaho-Atsina at least did
> *_j_ > _n_ initially.
>
> Alex
>

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