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CONLANG  March 2014, Week 4

CONLANG March 2014, Week 4

Subject:

Re: A History of Angosian Language and Society

From:

Daniel Bowman <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 25 Mar 2014 07:48:10 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (203 lines)

Hm, Angayus is on the planet Anga.  It sounds like you've learned Justin B
Rye's Lesson Seven of Xenolinguistics! :-p

> | The names of a species, empire, language, homeworld, homestar and so on
> | will all be self-evidently related; Ogrons come from Ogros, Arisians come
> | from Arisia, Arcturans come from Arcturus, and Humans no doubt come from
> | Humus.
> [http://www.xibalba.demon.co.uk/jbr/lingo.html]
>

Not so fast!  Keep in mind, we are reading an account by a colonist who
comes from off-world.  I'd argue that Dr. Lucero's use of "Angosian" has
parallels with, say, our use of the word "European" to denote an inhabitant
of Europe.  Regarding "Angius" vs "Anga," I should have made this more
clear: "Angius" is the Anglicisation of In Anga (ɪn ɑŋɑ ), which is the
name for the home planet in Angosey (it literally translates as "the
egg").  The so-called "Angosians" (those who speak the ritual language
Angosey) actually refer to themselves as "al aved" (ɑl ɑvɛɖ).  This
literally translates as "the people" or "the humans."  Dr. Lucero would
pronounce "Angosey" as
"ɑŋgoʊseɪ" whereas Angosey speakers would pronounce it "ɑnkɔsɛɪ."  So it's
important to recognize the filter that the good professor is seeing through
when writing up his description - I should have noted this explicitly.
In general, I need to come up with a narrative of how people from Earth
were able to colonize part of Angius, how they contacted the native
inhabitants, and what the consequences were.  In any case, it seems that
first contact was made with Angosian language speakers, or perhaps these
native peoples were seen as more "authoritative" due to their apparent
erudition - so the entire planet came to be called "Angius" in complete
ignorance of whatever the other cultures on the planet thought.


> So, following the seeming path of least resistance of development of
> writing on Earth, this will probably be the stages of development from
> "proto-writing" to logography to a complex script where the logograms begin
> to be used for sound value alone.
>

Yes, that's what I was thinking.

>
> >However, in one site (the modern day native city of Streydan), a pivotal
> event changed the course of Angosian civilization.  A source about 300
> years later speaks of an "angel" (Angosey:  al kayetana) appearing to a
> village woman.  Over the course of the next twenty years, the angel
> instructed her on the method of forecasting the weather based on the
> positions of the  27 other planets visible in the night sky,
>
> Ah, is this something to do with the origin of the Angosey base 28, then?
>  What's a "planet", and is there (exactly) one celestial luminary that's
> not reckoned among them?  (A sun?  Anga itself, if their cosmology was
> advanced enough then to see it as of the same kind?)
>

Yes, I think there's a connection with the numbering system.  A "planet" is
the same in this place as it is here in the Solar System (a "large" body in
hydrostatic equilibrium). There are, in fact, three suns (not failing to
suggest some connection with Christian myth, just saying :-)).  I believe
other stars are visible, but I'm not quite decided on that point yet.
During the time of climate stability, nothing was visible beyond the
planet's atmosphere, although diffuse light did make it through sufficient
to sustain the world.  There's a whole cosmic drama behind that, but that's
another post for another day.

>
> >The increasingly sophisticated mathematical developments and flourishing
> religious practice demanded a less cumbersome writing system, and thus
> within about half a millennium a "proto-runic" script was developed.
>
> This will then be the point in time at which the script descends to
> alphabetic from whatever it was before (syllabic, or something even
> hairier?).  Now why would these developments have motivated an _alphabet_,
> specifically?
>

Is an alphabet more efficient at encoding large amounts of technical terms
rapidly?  An interesting question.

>
> On the religious practice side, I could see the story that correct Angosey
> pronunciation of the rituals etc. was considered essential, but the script
> as it was imprecise about phonemics and didn't provide close enough
> guidance to the subtleties, and so some very precise, segment-by-segment
> system was innovated.  (Compare the use of vowel pointing in Semitic
> scripts.  Maybe also compare the remarkable way the Vedic speakers
> developed phonology before even literacy, out of concern for their scared
> texts, and so were able to put their alphabet in the right order when they
> did acquire it.)
>
> On the mathematical side, certainly advanced mathematics wants a system of
> writing to suit, but pronunciation isn't one of its major concerns; in
> general these concerns are having symbolic ways to express mathematical
> objects and operations, sleeker and lighter-weight than just writing them
> out in sentences, and without awkwardnesses like the subtractive business
> in Roman numerals, so that they serve as a useful aid manipulation and
> abstract thinking.
> One element of this system will be a proper system of notation for
> numbers, but you've already got that well covered if writing arose from a
> tally system for economic transations.  Beyond that, another big
> development is a notation for _variables_, so you don't just have to rely
> on giving a unique comprehensible name to each object or quantity in your
> problem, possibly supplemented by your language's deictic strategies.  Here
> in western Europe things like the = and + signs were also advances, but in
> a logography the word used for "equals" already serves as an = sign so
> that's probably not a hurdle.
>
> Yes, I will have to think about that.


> Perhaps crypto-scripts did spring up, but in view of the structural
> similarities my reconstruction is based on, my first impulse is that
> ceremonial is not such; the more down-to-earth hypothesis that it arose as
> just a decorative, calligraphic variant gets my plausibility vote.
>

Sure, I think that makes sense.

>
> Actually, quasi-related question: did the Angosey scripts have a (shared)
> alphabetic order?  If they did, that would have quite a large influence on
> the later realignment of ceremonial with contemporary runic.
>

As I've written them, they did.  So, yes, why not?

>
> >One thousand years after that, the remarkably stable Streydan-Hatuley
> empire
>
> Remarkably stable -- aw, what fun is that? :-p  There's a systemic bias in
> conworlds, I think, that not enough hàppens in history, that paging forward
> a thousand years leaves things looking far too much the same.  Even if the
> Roman civilisation existed both in the 5th century BC and the 5th AD, even
> if the Byzantines did in the 5th and 15th centures, quite a lot of internal
> and external changes happened between then.  (There's a TVTropes page on
> this, but I couldn't find it, and I don't mind; I wouldn't want to be the
> sort of person who knows the TVTropes name for everything...)
>

My concept for the world is to have it seem extremely old, with many more
ruins than occupied locations, etc, but I can certainly compress the
history a bit.  There needs to be enough time for the natural world to
readjust to climate change - that should take several thousand years each
time, based on my understanding of the response of North America to the
beginning of the latest glacial intermission.

>
>
>
> >One orb was apparently a textbook on harmonic analysis, with innovations
> in pure math that were not realized until the 22nd century on Earth.
>  Another was a recounting of the religious rituals still observed.  Others
> dealt with scientific observations; one was a series of ballads and the
> final orb was apparently a novel.  In any case, there was no indication of
> the sudden calamity ahead, and this is perhaps the best evidence we have of
> its swiftness.
>
> I'm no archaeologist but this does make me go "absence of evidence is not
> evidence of absence"...
>

Dr. Lucero needs to work on his scientific methods :-)

>
> >The steadiness of the climate permitted a relatively rapid recovery, and
> by the second millennium a new empire (middle Streydan) occupied the
> region.  During this consolidation, the extant versions of runic and
> ceremonial script were gathered and codified.  The final, standardized
> orthography was transmitted virtually without modification down to the
> modern day in the temples,
>
> This is good.  I wonder if something like printing was (re?)introduced at
> this time or soon after, or if not printing at least some other technology
> or standard or whatnot that would stabilise the letterforms.
>
> >The stability of Angosey and the Angosian writing systems over ten
> thousand years is nothing short of remarkable.  Most authors attribute this
> to the ritual use of the language and the life-or-death immediacy Angosian
> knowledge had during most of human history on the planet.  However, the
> language and the writing system did evolve considerably before the
> middle-Streydan epoch, suggesting that the tongue was in more common use
> prior to that time.
>
> Too remarkable for me, at this point.  If this was my mythos I'd probably
> divide the timescales after the first great cataclysm by five or so.
>
> Why was the rate of technological development in the middle and late
> Streydan periods so much slower here than just after contact with the
> angel, especially given the old Angosian knowledge that the people
> retained?  Why, for that matter, wouldn't they have translated the old
> Angosey writings into the common language of the time, removing the
> linguistic import of the "life-and-death immediacy" of the knowledge?  If
> it's all because of the cult(?) surrounding the old Angosey materials, how
> did thàt remain so stable over centuries, much less millennia, so as to
> enable this?
>

I will think on this.  Thanks for the comments!

>
> Alex
>

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June 2007, Week 4
June 2007, Week 3
June 2007, Week 2
June 2007, Week 1
May 2007, Week 5
May 2007, Week 4
May 2007, Week 3
May 2007, Week 2
May 2007, Week 1
April 2007, Week 5
April 2007, Week 4
April 2007, Week 3
April 2007, Week 2
April 2007, Week 1
March 2007, Week 5
March 2007, Week 4
March 2007, Week 3
March 2007, Week 2
March 2007, Week 1
February 2007, Week 4
February 2007, Week 3
February 2007, Week 2
February 2007, Week 1
January 2007, Week 5
January 2007, Week 4
January 2007, Week 3
January 2007, Week 2
January 2007, Week 1
December 2006, Week 5
December 2006, Week 4
December 2006, Week 3
December 2006, Week 2
December 2006, Week 1
November 2006, Week 5
November 2006, Week 4
November 2006, Week 3
November 2006, Week 2
November 2006, Week 1
October 2006, Week 5
October 2006, Week 4
October 2006, Week 3
October 2006, Week 2
October 2006, Week 1
September 2006, Week 5
September 2006, Week 4
September 2006, Week 3
September 2006, Week 2
September 2006, Week 1
August 2006, Week 5
August 2006, Week 4
August 2006, Week 3
August 2006, Week 2
August 2006, Week 1
July 2006, Week 5
July 2006, Week 4
July 2006, Week 3
July 2006, Week 2
July 2006, Week 1
June 2006, Week 5
June 2006, Week 4
June 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 2
June 2006, Week 1
May 2006, Week 5
May 2006, Week 4
May 2006, Week 3
May 2006, Week 2
May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 5
April 2006, Week 4
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 5
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3
March 2006, Week 2
March 2006, Week 1
February 2006, Week 4
February 2006, Week 3
February 2006, Week 2
February 2006, Week 1
January 2006, Week 5
January 2006, Week 4
January 2006, Week 3
January 2006, Week 2
January 2006, Week 1
December 2005, Week 5
December 2005, Week 4
December 2005, Week 3
December 2005, Week 2
December 2005, Week 1
November 2005, Week 5
November 2005, Week 4
November 2005, Week 3
November 2005, Week 2
November 2005, Week 1
October 2005, Week 5
October 2005, Week 4
October 2005, Week 3
October 2005, Week 2
October 2005, Week 1
September 2005, Week 5
September 2005, Week 4
September 2005, Week 3
September 2005, Week 2
September 2005, Week 1
August 2005, Week 5
August 2005, Week 4
August 2005, Week 3
August 2005, Week 2
August 2005, Week 1
July 2005, Week 5
July 2005, Week 4
July 2005, Week 3
July 2005, Week 2
July 2005, Week 1
June 2005, Week 5
June 2005, Week 4
June 2005, Week 3
June 2005, Week 2
June 2005, Week 1
May 2005, Week 5
May 2005, Week 4
May 2005, Week 3
May 2005, Week 2
May 2005, Week 1
April 2005, Week 5
April 2005, Week 4
April 2005, Week 3
April 2005, Week 2
April 2005, Week 1
March 2005, Week 5
March 2005, Week 4
March 2005, Week 3
March 2005, Week 2
March 2005, Week 1
February 2005, Week 4
February 2005, Week 3
February 2005, Week 2
February 2005, Week 1
January 2005, Week 5
January 2005, Week 4
January 2005, Week 3
January 2005, Week 2
January 2005, Week 1
December 2004, Week 5
December 2004, Week 4
December 2004, Week 3
December 2004, Week 2
December 2004, Week 1
November 2004, Week 5
November 2004, Week 4
November 2004, Week 3
November 2004, Week 2
November 2004, Week 1
October 2004, Week 5
October 2004, Week 4
October 2004, Week 3
October 2004, Week 2
October 2004, Week 1
September 2004, Week 5
September 2004, Week 4
September 2004, Week 3
September 2004, Week 2
September 2004, Week 1
August 2004, Week 5
August 2004, Week 4
August 2004, Week 3
August 2004, Week 2
August 2004, Week 1
July 2004, Week 5
July 2004, Week 4
July 2004, Week 3
July 2004, Week 2
July 2004, Week 1
June 2004, Week 5
June 2004, Week 4
June 2004, Week 3
June 2004, Week 2
June 2004, Week 1
May 2004, Week 5
May 2004, Week 4
May 2004, Week 3
May 2004, Week 2
May 2004, Week 1
April 2004, Week 5
April 2004, Week 4
April 2004, Week 3
April 2004, Week 2
April 2004, Week 1
March 2004, Week 5
March 2004, Week 4
March 2004, Week 3
March 2004, Week 2
March 2004, Week 1
February 2004, Week 5
February 2004, Week 4
February 2004, Week 3
February 2004, Week 2
February 2004, Week 1
January 2004, Week 5
January 2004, Week 4
January 2004, Week 3
January 2004, Week 2
January 2004, Week 1
December 2003, Week 5
December 2003, Week 4
December 2003, Week 3
December 2003, Week 2
December 2003, Week 1
November 2003, Week 5
November 2003, Week 4
November 2003, Week 3
November 2003, Week 2
November 2003, Week 1
October 2003, Week 5
October 2003, Week 4
October 2003, Week 3
October 2003, Week 2
October 2003, Week 1
September 2003, Week 5
September 2003, Week 4
September 2003, Week 3
September 2003, Week 2
September 2003, Week 1
August 2003, Week 5
August 2003, Week 4
August 2003, Week 3
August 2003, Week 2
August 2003, Week 1
July 2003, Week 5
July 2003, Week 4
July 2003, Week 3
July 2003, Week 2
July 2003, Week 1
June 2003, Week 5
June 2003, Week 4
June 2003, Week 3
June 2003, Week 2
June 2003, Week 1
May 2003, Week 5
May 2003, Week 4
May 2003, Week 3
May 2003, Week 2
May 2003, Week 1
April 2003, Week 5
April 2003, Week 4
April 2003, Week 3
April 2003, Week 2
April 2003, Week 1
March 2003, Week 5
March 2003, Week 4
March 2003, Week 3
March 2003, Week 2
March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
February 2003, Week 3
February 2003, Week 2
February 2003, Week 1
January 2003, Week 5
January 2003, Week 4
January 2003, Week 3
January 2003, Week 2
January 2003, Week 1
December 2002, Week 5
December 2002, Week 4
December 2002, Week 3
December 2002, Week 2
December 2002, Week 1
November 2002, Week 5
November 2002, Week 4
November 2002, Week 3
November 2002, Week 2
November 2002, Week 1
October 2002, Week 5
October 2002, Week 4
October 2002, Week 3
October 2002, Week 2
October 2002, Week 1
September 2002, Week 5
September 2002, Week 4
September 2002, Week 3
September 2002, Week 2
September 2002, Week 1
August 2002, Week 5
August 2002, Week 4
August 2002, Week 3
August 2002, Week 2
August 2002, Week 1
July 2002, Week 5
July 2002, Week 4
July 2002, Week 3
July 2002, Week 2
July 2002, Week 1
June 2002, Week 5
June 2002, Week 4
June 2002, Week 3
June 2002, Week 2
June 2002, Week 1
May 2002, Week 5
May 2002, Week 4
May 2002, Week 3
May 2002, Week 2
May 2002, Week 1
April 2002, Week 5
April 2002, Week 4
April 2002, Week 3
April 2002, Week 2
April 2002, Week 1
March 2002, Week 5
March 2002, Week 4
March 2002, Week 3
March 2002, Week 2
March 2002, Week 1
February 2002, Week 4
February 2002, Week 3
February 2002, Week 2
February 2002, Week 1
January 2002, Week 5
January 2002, Week 4
January 2002, Week 3
January 2002, Week 2
January 2002, Week 1
December 2001, Week 5
December 2001, Week 4
December 2001, Week 3
December 2001, Week 2
December 2001, Week 1
November 2001, Week 5
November 2001, Week 4
November 2001, Week 3
November 2001, Week 2
November 2001, Week 1
October 2001, Week 5
October 2001, Week 4
October 2001, Week 3
October 2001, Week 2
October 2001, Week 1
September 2001, Week 5
September 2001, Week 4
September 2001, Week 3
September 2001, Week 2
September 2001, Week 1
August 2001, Week 5
August 2001, Week 4
August 2001, Week 3
August 2001, Week 2
August 2001, Week 1
July 2001, Week 5
July 2001, Week 4
July 2001, Week 3
July 2001, Week 2
July 2001, Week 1
June 2001, Week 5
June 2001, Week 4
June 2001, Week 3
June 2001, Week 2
June 2001, Week 1
May 2001, Week 5
May 2001, Week 4
May 2001, Week 3
May 2001, Week 2
May 2001, Week 1
April 2001, Week 5
April 2001, Week 4
April 2001, Week 3
April 2001, Week 2
April 2001, Week 1
March 2001, Week 5
March 2001, Week 4
March 2001, Week 3
March 2001, Week 2
March 2001, Week 1
February 2001, Week 4
February 2001, Week 3
February 2001, Week 2
February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
January 2001, Week 4
January 2001, Week 3
January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
December 2000, Week 4
December 2000, Week 3
December 2000, Week 2
December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
November 2000, Week 4
November 2000, Week 3
November 2000, Week 2
November 2000, Week 1
October 2000, Week 5
October 2000, Week 4
October 2000, Week 3
October 2000, Week 2
October 2000, Week 1
September 2000, Week 5
September 2000, Week 4
September 2000, Week 3
September 2000, Week 2
September 2000, Week 1
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August 2000, Week 3
August 2000, Week 2
August 2000, Week 1
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July 2000, Week 4
July 2000, Week 3
July 2000, Week 2
July 2000, Week 1
June 2000, Week 5
June 2000, Week 4
June 2000, Week 3
June 2000, Week 2
June 2000, Week 1
May 2000, Week 5
May 2000, Week 4
May 2000, Week 3
May 2000, Week 2
May 2000, Week 1
April 2000, Week 5
April 2000, Week 4
April 2000, Week 3
April 2000, Week 2
April 2000, Week 1
March 2000, Week 5
March 2000, Week 4
March 2000, Week 3
March 2000, Week 2
March 2000, Week 1
February 2000, Week 5
February 2000, Week 4
February 2000, Week 3
February 2000, Week 2
February 2000, Week 1
January 2000, Week 5
January 2000, Week 4
January 2000, Week 3
January 2000, Week 2
January 2000, Week 1
December 1999, Week 5
December 1999, Week 4
December 1999, Week 3
December 1999, Week 2
December 1999, Week 1
November 1999, Week 5
November 1999, Week 4
November 1999, Week 3
November 1999, Week 2
November 1999, Week 1
October 1999, Week 5
October 1999, Week 4
October 1999, Week 3
October 1999, Week 2
October 1999, Week 1
September 1999, Week 5
September 1999, Week 4
September 1999, Week 3
September 1999, Week 2
September 1999, Week 1
August 1999, Week 5
August 1999, Week 4
August 1999, Week 3
August 1999, Week 2
August 1999, Week 1
July 1999, Week 5
July 1999, Week 4
July 1999, Week 3
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July 1999, Week 1
June 1999, Week 5
June 1999, Week 4
June 1999, Week 3
June 1999, Week 2
June 1999, Week 1
May 1999, Week 5
May 1999, Week 4
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May 1999, Week 1
April 1999, Week 5
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April 1999, Week 3
April 1999, Week 2
April 1999, Week 1
March 1999, Week 5
March 1999, Week 4
March 1999, Week 3
March 1999, Week 2
March 1999, Week 1
February 1999, Week 5
February 1999, Week 4
February 1999, Week 3
February 1999, Week 2
February 1999, Week 1
January 1999, Week 5
January 1999, Week 4
January 1999, Week 3
January 1999, Week 2
January 1999, Week 1
December 1998, Week 5
December 1998, Week 4
December 1998, Week 3
December 1998, Week 2
December 1998, Week 1
November 1998, Week 5
November 1998, Week 4
November 1998, Week 3
November 1998, Week 2
November 1998, Week 1
October 1998, Week 5
October 1998, Week 4
October 1998, Week 3
October 1998, Week 2
October 1998, Week 1
September 1998, Week 5
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September 1998, Week 3

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