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CONLANG  January 2016, Week 4

CONLANG January 2016, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Latin chocolate (was:: THEORY: Yes-no Or Questions)

From:

"Mark J. Reed" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Mon, 25 Jan 2016 13:03:33 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (70 lines)

For the record, I know that Latin is still in use and was not surprised to
find it has a word for chocolate; even Klingon has a (monosyllabic!) word
for chocolate, and it is not native to their planet. :)

Given the history of Latin, though, I was curious about the path taken by
new words, especially for terms that were introduced well before modern
times but still well after its heyday as a European lingua franca.



On Mon, Jan 25, 2016 at 12:12 PM, R A Brown <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> On 25/01/2016 16:22, David McCann wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 25 Jan 2016 08:33:06 -0500 "Mark J. Reed" wrote:
>>
>> OT, but I assume chocolate was unknown to the Romans.
>>> Does "socolata"  come from a time when Latin was still
>>>  in active use in European writing, or is it a
>>> back-formation from the romlangs?
>>>
>>
>> I believe the usual word in modern Latin is
>> "chocolatum".
>>
>
> Ach y fi!  That's just English with a Latin ending!
>
> _ch_ in Latin originally represented ancient Greek χ [kʰ].
> It came to be used in words like _pulcher_ (beautiful),
> _sepulchrum_ (tomb) which had been spelled with the _h_ -
> but the reason why is obscure.  In medieval Latin we come
> across Classical _mihi_ and _nihil_ spelled _michi_ and
> _nichil_ where _ch_ represented [k] (whereas in Medieval
> Latin _c_ before _i_ or _e_ had a 'soft' sound).
>
> But _ch_ was (and is) [kʰ] or [k].  If you wanted to have
> initial [tʃ] then _ciocolat-- would be the form, using
> modern Italianate pronunciation of Church Latin.
>
> The form _socoláta_ (noun feminine) is obviously a Latinized
> version of the (modern) Greek σοκολάτα, thus continuing a
> practice begun long ago by the Romans  :)
>
> Latin is, of course, still in use: descriptions of newly
>>  discovered plants are only accepted if written in Latin,
>>  an attempt to substitute English having been rejected a
>>  few years ago.
>>
>
> Euge!
>
> --
> Ray
> ==================================
> http://www.carolandray.plus.com
> ==================================
> "Ein Kopf, der auf seine eigenen Kosten denkt,
> wird immer Eingriffe in die Sprache thun."
> [J.G. Hamann, 1760]
> "A mind that thinks at its own expense
> will always interfere with language".
>



-- 
Mark J. Reed <[log in to unmask]>

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