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AUXLANG  October 2016, Week 3

AUXLANG October 2016, Week 3

Subject:

Re: minimal base vocabulary for sino-auxlang Re: A Phonological System for Chinese Auxlang & eastern asian universal language

From:

Leo Moser <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 21 Oct 2016 14:40:04 -0700

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (150 lines)

The goal of most artificial a-posteriori auxlangs IMO has not been immediate recognizability, but rather the ease of learning. (Interlingua may be an exception -- within the Romanic sphere.) 

English as an auxlang is going to be recognizable to many in Britain, North America , Australia, etc. but that does not make it ideal as a global auxlang. It's spelling is terrible, so many vowels in various dialects, and many other aspects that are needlessly difficult for global populations.

Same is true of Chinese/Mandarin, perhaps even more so. The main potential value for a conlang based on Chinese, would be in my opinion:
1. Fun. There are ten-thousand options.
2. As a potential crutch for making it easier to translate Chinese texts (including internet chatter) into something more readily readable by the rest of the world. I've looked into this, but haven't the time to pursue. 

Regards,            LEO

Leo Moser

-----Original Message-----
From: International Auxiliary Languages [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Leo Moser
Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2016 3:22 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: minimal base vocabulary for sino-auxlang Re: A Phonological System for Chinese Auxlang & eastern asian universal language

Leo adds:
For any of you here who feel you would enjoy an introduction to Classical Chinese, I can strongly recommend:
http://faculty.vassar.edu/brvannor/ClassicalChineseEveryone.pdf

 A few of Logan's interests may be touched upon there. 

Best regards,          LEO


-----Original Message-----
From: International Auxiliary Languages [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Logan Streondj
Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 7:42 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: minimal base vocabulary for sino-auxlang Re: A Phonological System for Chinese Auxlang & eastern asian universal language

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Hi Victor and Leo,

Phonology may be interesting and all,
however for over a thousand years it was all but meaningless in China.
There are many not mutually intelligible dialects, and for a very long time, everything was written in Classical Chinese, yet people in China, Japan, Korea and the whole sino-sphere understood i t, even though for instance Japanese and Korean are not sinitic languages, they are tungusic/altaic.

So I think for the sinosphere, the phonology is irrelevant, what is important is a grammar using Chinese characters, which is fairly similar to Classical Chinese and-or Standard Mandarin, to increase the depth of understanding of history and present.

The phonology and word sounds can be made up later, For instance could use the SPEL/Pyash sounds.

I as someone with almost no Chinese language knowledge, would like help with the previously requested words.

I need grammar words (either prepositions or postpositions) for the following (as the chinese letters, not phonemics):

nominative-case
accusative-case
instrumental-case
dative-case
genitive-case

verbal-case
dependant-clause

realis-mood
deontic-mood
epistemic-mood
interrogative-mood
conditional-mood

I have made some guesstimates in my limited knowledge, since these are super-common grammar particles, I've limited it to 1 letter, however rare it may be:

者 nominative-case
顆 accusative-case
由 instrumental-case
到 dative-case
的 genitive-case

是 verbal-case
那 dependant-clause

啊 realis-mood
嗎 deontic-mood
啊 imperative-mood
就 conditional-mood
呕 epistemic-mood


Wondering what your thoughts may be.

Thanks,

On 2016-10-11 09:39 PM, Victor Chan wrote:
> I will present my constructed phonology for Chinese Auxlang. The 
> emphasis of the phonology is in the following decreasing order: 1) 
> common topological traits of local languages, 2) practicality for 
> formal lingua franca, 3) learn-ability for native speakers of a 
> Chinese dialect, and 4) learn-ability for people who do not speak any 
> Chinese language.
> 
> Analysis: -For frequency on dialects, common three way place of 
> articulation on stop, nasal, and fricative will be used while 
> affricate will be limited to one place of articulation. Five vowel 
> system will be used with four additional diphthongs on open syllables.
> -For foreign learn-ability, Classical Chinese voice contrast is used 
> over tone contrast of the yin-yang tone pairs. For the same reason, 
> checked tones will not be phonemic and co-occur with final stops.
> Common four tones of Mandarin dialects will be used as basis which 
> will be reduced to two phonemic tones by Middle Chinese voicing 
> contrast. This will result in two phonemic tones which will become 
> neutralized in syllables with final stops. -To reduce homophones and 
> account for possible systematic gap, syllable structure will be C (w,
> i) V (C) where final consonant is restricted to nasal and oral stops.
> 
> Consonants: -ph, th, kh, p, t, k, b, d, g, ’ ~ (null onset before <w,
> y>) -<ch, c, j> as aspirated, voiceless, and voiced affricate
> respectively -f, v, s, z, x, <h> as voiced velar fricative -m, n, <ng> 
> as velar nasal Approximants: l, w, j <y> Vowels: a, e, i, o, u
> Diphthongs: <ay, ao, oy, eo> as [aj, aw, oj, ew] Phonotactics: C (y,
> w) V (m, n, ng, p, t, k) or C [ay, ao, oy, eo] where [] mark 
> obligatory segments -onset /ng/ have similar allophone as its 
> counterpart in Standard Mandarin
> 
> Some grapheme ideas: -place /q/ at the end of syllable to mark high 
> tone and set low tone as default -prevent capitalization so capital 
> letters can be used as silent letters to distinguish homophone
> 

- --
Logan Streondj,
A dream of Gaia's future.
website: http://joyfullifestyle.ca
twitter: https://twitter.com/streondj

You can use encrypted email with me,
how to: https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org/en/
key fingerprint:
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