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CONLANG Home

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CONLANG  October 2016, Week 3

CONLANG October 2016, Week 3

Subject:

Re: An eastern Asian universal language?

From:

Alex Fink <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 20 Oct 2016 19:29:24 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (23 lines)

I hoped that I could get us talking about 把 and 被, but no, oh well.  Against my better judgment then:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2016 15:18:51 -0700, Leo Moser <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Ray winked at me and said about my reference to a "fun East Asian conlang": 
>What other possibility is there for "[a]n eastern Asian universal language" for anyone who shares my view of auxlangs?   ;)
>
>That was rather my point. Inside China, Mandarin is already the auxlang. Beyond, it cannot IMO sail far, even inside the historic Sino-sphere.
>
>My view of global auxlangs is not as negative as Ray's. English now plays that role to a degree, but it is not IMO well designed for it.

It's not well designed for much of anything, because by and large it wasn't designed!  About Mandarin one can say the same.  But both manage to serve the purpose of facilitating communication across large populations.

My view of global auxlangs is that anyone today who believes in the goals of the auxlang movement and then sits down to design a global auxlang has, categorically, already gone wrong.  For an auxlang to succeed is entirely a question of network effects.  And in this century we already have some comparatively-widely-spoken auxlangs like Esperanto, so (supposing no natlang will do) the best way for an individual to further the movement is to join one, their warts aside.  Doing otherwise is like trying to unite the world online by building your own competitor to Facebook -- Google tried that, and although their product was probably technically superior in terms of features, and they started from a commanding position in related markets, Facebook's dominance did not budge, what with everyone already being there.  

The masses don't choose which language to learn for its features!  They choose which language to learn for the utility of the set of people they then get to speak to.  And as David points out, there's no free lunch here.  No matter how much you try to game the choice of your lexicon so that you'll get, say, both Mandarin and Japanese speakers in this set automatically, you won't.

The _political_ aspects of the question are possibly of some interest: extant successful auxlangs like Esperanto might with their European cast be politically unsuitable for an auxlang for East Asia in particular, as might anything too heavily bearing the influence of just Chinese, etc.  But what the lot of us have been talking about here hasn't been the politics.  (Well, no crown: I guess that's for the better...)

So I reach Ray's conclusion: I can only see auxlang-makers as those who want to make fun macaronic conlangs.  Which is a pursuit for which I can't blame 'em, unless they get too invested in the accompanying feel-good story.  

Alex

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