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CONLANG  May 2017, Week 4

CONLANG May 2017, Week 4

Subject:

Re: speaker's gender affect on language

From:

Seth KAZAN <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 28 May 2017 17:04:34 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (262 lines)

It's just an hypothesis...
I've not found why this linguistic design that don't follow universal
laws of phonology...

2017-05-27 19:13 UTC+02:00, Paul Schleitwiler, FCM
<[log in to unmask]>:
> OK. Why "avoid masculine sex appeal on female"?
> Is this like hijab and burqa  to control the the behavior of men 'caused'
> by the physicality of women?
> Would Laadan speaking men be swarmed by women if they uttered 'forbidden'
> sounds?
> Deus benedicat tibi in omnibus semper,
> Paul
>
> On Sat, May 27, 2017 at 2:17 AM, Seth KAZAN <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> The lack of some consonants in Laadan can be seen as an effort of
>> efficiency to reduce the effort of clarity or to avoid masculine sex
>> appeal on female...
>> But that not explain the coincidence...
>>
>> 2017-05-26 22:20 UTC+02:00, Paul Schleitwiler, FCM
>> <[log in to unmask]>:
>> > Your coincidence and your references are very interesting, Seth. The
>> > note
>> > in the first reference about the difference between male speakers  of
>> > English and French might help explain why some English speakers view
>> French
>> > as a more effeminate language.
>> > How else could this be explicitly used in creating a conlang as you did
>> > with tuskheejlusav?
>> > Dieu vous bénit toujours, toutes façons,
>> > Paul
>> >
>> > On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 9:08 AM, Seth KAZAN <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> I found this for a  begining of answer...
>> >> https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/halshs-00764811/document
>> >> http://www.newswise.com/articles/voice-appeal
>> >>
>> >> 2017-05-17 21:04 GMT+02:00 Seth KAZAN <[log in to unmask]>:
>> >> > Another thing, the phonology of the làadan which is built for a
>> >> > predominantly feminine use, bizarrely has a lack of certain
>> >> > consonants
>> >> ...
>> >> > What intrigues me is that, without knowing it, I partly reproduce
>> >> > this
>> >> > bizarre when I distinguished a feminine and masculine pronunciation
>> >> > in
>> >> > tuskheejlusav ...
>> >> > Yet I do not have the same mother tongue as S H Elgin...
>> >> > And I have not found any other linguistic or psychological
>> >> > explanation
>> >> that
>> >> > explains this coincidence...
>> >> > Do you have an opinion above that...
>> >> >
>> >> > 2017-05-17 19:25 GMT+02:00 Paul Schleitwiler, FCM
>> >> > <[log in to unmask]>:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Occupation may have more to do with color discrimination than
>> culture.
>> >> As
>> >> >> an artist, I am aware of and can name more color differences than
>> most
>> >> >> people. But can women artists do better than me?
>> >> >> Culture, in the fine grained sense, may be a cause of the gender
>> >> >> difference. Cultural differences between men and women are like
>> >> dialectal
>> >> >> differences in language. What is it about the life of women and
>> >> >> girls
>> >> that
>> >> >> gives them reason, like artists, to discriminate and name more
>> colors?
>> >> >> Que Deus te abençoe sempre, e de todas as maneiras,
>> >> >> Paul
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 8:15 AM, Jyri Lehtinen
>> >> >> <[log in to unmask]
>> >> >
>> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > How well do these studies differentiate actual perception of
>> >> >> > colour
>> >> from
>> >> >> > cultural factors? There isn't necessarily a one-to-one
>> >> >> > correspondence
>> >> >> > between different degrees of perceiving colour differences and
>> >> >> > how
>> >> fine
>> >> >> > grained colour terminology you bother using in your everyday
>> >> >> > life.
>> >> >> > As
>> >> an
>> >> >> > example, when I look out from my window, I can see a bunch of
>> >> different
>> >> >> > colours but at the same time I'm happiest to simply call most of
>> >> >> > them
>> >> >> > "green".
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >    -Jyri
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > 2017-05-17 13:44 GMT+02:00 Juliano Cruz Gusmão
>> >> >> > <[log in to unmask]>:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > > It is already confirmed that women are better in
>> >> >> > > differentiating
>> >> >> > > colors
>> >> >> > and
>> >> >> > > man, shapes. This result came from scientific researchs.
>> >> >> > > I think this can endorse those results.
>> >> >> > > And yes, I think the description might give a clue of the
>> >> >> > > gender
>> >> >> > > of
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > speaker. Althought not 100% certain, I'm a man but work with
>> >> drawing,
>> >> >> > > painting and desing, therefore, I percieve colors better than
>> >> >> > > men
>> >> who
>> >> >> > don't
>> >> >> > > work in thes fields, as long as a woman architect would
>> >> >> > > describe
>> >> well
>> >> >> > > shapes and forms.
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Happy to contribut,
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Juliano.
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Juliano Cruz Gusmão.
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > E-mail: [log in to unmask]
>> >> >> > > Facebook: Juliano Cruz Gusmão
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > "O pássaro de Minerva só alça seu vôo ao cair da noite."
>> >> >> > > "La birdo de Minerva nur ekflugas cxe la nokta ekapero."
>> >> >> > >      Hegel
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > "Sem um desvio do normal, o progresso é impossível."
>> >> >> > > "Sen devio de la normaleco, la progresso neeblas."
>> >> >> > >      Frank Zappa
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > "Os cegos fazem de tudo para ver a luz, os tolos, para não
>> >> >> > > vê-la"
>> >> >> > > "La blinduloj faros cxion por vidi la lumon, la stultoj, por ne
>> >> >> > > gxin
>> >> >> > vidi."
>> >> >> > >      A. H. fuerstenthal
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > 2017-05-11 16:28 GMT-03:00 Paul Schleitwiler, FCM <
>> >> >> > > [log in to unmask]>:
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > > One granddaughter sent me a pdf of the research study she did
>> >> >> > > > for
>> >> a
>> >> >> > > college
>> >> >> > > > class about gender differences in the use of language to
>> >> >> > > > describe
>> >> >> > colors.
>> >> >> > > > The result was interesting.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > "... this study did in fact conclude that there is a
>> >> >> > > > difference
>> >> that
>> >> >> > > > is
>> >> >> > > > evident between
>> >> >> > > > the semantics and pragmatics of genders that does not appear
>> >> >> > > > to
>> >> >> > > > be
>> >> >> > > affected
>> >> >> > > > by nationality, age, the amount of schooling, or any other
>> >> >> > > > number
>> >> of
>> >> >> > > > socioeconomic factors, including their workplace. Wolfram and
>> >> Estes
>> >> >> > > states,
>> >> >> > > > “in every language, there are a variety of ways to convey the
>> >> >> > > > same
>> >> >> > > > information or accomplish the same purpose, and the choice is
>> of
>> >> how
>> >> >> > > > to
>> >> >> > > say
>> >> >> > > > something depends upon who is talking to whom under what
>> >> >> > > > circumstances”
>> >> >> > > > (Wolfram and Eses 86)."
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Also, while women used more names for colors, their
>> descriptions
>> >> >> > > > were
>> >> >> > > "more
>> >> >> > > > specific, less certain, and less objective" than those of the
>> >> >> > > > men.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > While only a minor study by an undergraduate who isn't a
>> >> linguistics
>> >> >> > > major,
>> >> >> > > > I thought to share this with you as seed for three or more
>> >> >> > > > discussions,
>> >> >> > > >     reactions to the study itself,
>> >> >> > > >     implications for color language in conlangs,
>> >> >> > > >     implications  for the concultures using conlangs ...
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > For example, can we tell from a written description of color
>> >> whether
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > > author was male or female? Why might a language develop
>> >> >> > > > certain
>> >> ways
>> >> >> > > > of
>> >> >> > > > speaking about colors? Since some languages have different
>> forms
>> >> for
>> >> >> > > > speakers who are male or female, or of different age or
>> >> >> > > > status
>> >> >> > > > or
>> >> >> > > affinity,
>> >> >> > > > what might this study suggest about specific areas, like
>> >> >> > > > color,
>> >> for
>> >> >> > > > conlangs?
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > God bless you always, all ways,
>> >> >> > > > Paul
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > I have finally discovered what’s wrong with my brain: On the
>> >> >> > > > left
>> >> >> > > > side,
>> >> >> > > > there is nothing right, and on the right side, there is
>> >> >> > > > nothing
>> >> >> > > > left.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > odd-language.tumblr.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> odd-language.tumblr.com
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> odd-language.tumblr.com
>>
>


-- 
odd-language.tumblr.com

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February 2008, Week 1
January 2008, Week 5
January 2008, Week 4
January 2008, Week 3
January 2008, Week 2
January 2008, Week 1
December 2007, Week 5
December 2007, Week 4
December 2007, Week 3
December 2007, Week 2
December 2007, Week 1
November 2007, Week 5
November 2007, Week 4
November 2007, Week 3
November 2007, Week 2
November 2007, Week 1
October 2007, Week 5
October 2007, Week 4
October 2007, Week 3
October 2007, Week 2
October 2007, Week 1
September 2007, Week 5
September 2007, Week 4
September 2007, Week 3
September 2007, Week 2
September 2007, Week 1
August 2007, Week 5
August 2007, Week 4
August 2007, Week 3
August 2007, Week 2
August 2007, Week 1
July 2007, Week 5
July 2007, Week 4
July 2007, Week 3
July 2007, Week 2
July 2007, Week 1
June 2007, Week 5
June 2007, Week 4
June 2007, Week 3
June 2007, Week 2
June 2007, Week 1
May 2007, Week 5
May 2007, Week 4
May 2007, Week 3
May 2007, Week 2
May 2007, Week 1
April 2007, Week 5
April 2007, Week 4
April 2007, Week 3
April 2007, Week 2
April 2007, Week 1
March 2007, Week 5
March 2007, Week 4
March 2007, Week 3
March 2007, Week 2
March 2007, Week 1
February 2007, Week 4
February 2007, Week 3
February 2007, Week 2
February 2007, Week 1
January 2007, Week 5
January 2007, Week 4
January 2007, Week 3
January 2007, Week 2
January 2007, Week 1
December 2006, Week 5
December 2006, Week 4
December 2006, Week 3
December 2006, Week 2
December 2006, Week 1
November 2006, Week 5
November 2006, Week 4
November 2006, Week 3
November 2006, Week 2
November 2006, Week 1
October 2006, Week 5
October 2006, Week 4
October 2006, Week 3
October 2006, Week 2
October 2006, Week 1
September 2006, Week 5
September 2006, Week 4
September 2006, Week 3
September 2006, Week 2
September 2006, Week 1
August 2006, Week 5
August 2006, Week 4
August 2006, Week 3
August 2006, Week 2
August 2006, Week 1
July 2006, Week 5
July 2006, Week 4
July 2006, Week 3
July 2006, Week 2
July 2006, Week 1
June 2006, Week 5
June 2006, Week 4
June 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 2
June 2006, Week 1
May 2006, Week 5
May 2006, Week 4
May 2006, Week 3
May 2006, Week 2
May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 5
April 2006, Week 4
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 5
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3
March 2006, Week 2
March 2006, Week 1
February 2006, Week 4
February 2006, Week 3
February 2006, Week 2
February 2006, Week 1
January 2006, Week 5
January 2006, Week 4
January 2006, Week 3
January 2006, Week 2
January 2006, Week 1
December 2005, Week 5
December 2005, Week 4
December 2005, Week 3
December 2005, Week 2
December 2005, Week 1
November 2005, Week 5
November 2005, Week 4
November 2005, Week 3
November 2005, Week 2
November 2005, Week 1
October 2005, Week 5
October 2005, Week 4
October 2005, Week 3
October 2005, Week 2
October 2005, Week 1
September 2005, Week 5
September 2005, Week 4
September 2005, Week 3
September 2005, Week 2
September 2005, Week 1
August 2005, Week 5
August 2005, Week 4
August 2005, Week 3
August 2005, Week 2
August 2005, Week 1
July 2005, Week 5
July 2005, Week 4
July 2005, Week 3
July 2005, Week 2
July 2005, Week 1
June 2005, Week 5
June 2005, Week 4
June 2005, Week 3
June 2005, Week 2
June 2005, Week 1
May 2005, Week 5
May 2005, Week 4
May 2005, Week 3
May 2005, Week 2
May 2005, Week 1
April 2005, Week 5
April 2005, Week 4
April 2005, Week 3
April 2005, Week 2
April 2005, Week 1
March 2005, Week 5
March 2005, Week 4
March 2005, Week 3
March 2005, Week 2
March 2005, Week 1
February 2005, Week 4
February 2005, Week 3
February 2005, Week 2
February 2005, Week 1
January 2005, Week 5
January 2005, Week 4
January 2005, Week 3
January 2005, Week 2
January 2005, Week 1
December 2004, Week 5
December 2004, Week 4
December 2004, Week 3
December 2004, Week 2
December 2004, Week 1
November 2004, Week 5
November 2004, Week 4
November 2004, Week 3
November 2004, Week 2
November 2004, Week 1
October 2004, Week 5
October 2004, Week 4
October 2004, Week 3
October 2004, Week 2
October 2004, Week 1
September 2004, Week 5
September 2004, Week 4
September 2004, Week 3
September 2004, Week 2
September 2004, Week 1
August 2004, Week 5
August 2004, Week 4
August 2004, Week 3
August 2004, Week 2
August 2004, Week 1
July 2004, Week 5
July 2004, Week 4
July 2004, Week 3
July 2004, Week 2
July 2004, Week 1
June 2004, Week 5
June 2004, Week 4
June 2004, Week 3
June 2004, Week 2
June 2004, Week 1
May 2004, Week 5
May 2004, Week 4
May 2004, Week 3
May 2004, Week 2
May 2004, Week 1
April 2004, Week 5
April 2004, Week 4
April 2004, Week 3
April 2004, Week 2
April 2004, Week 1
March 2004, Week 5
March 2004, Week 4
March 2004, Week 3
March 2004, Week 2
March 2004, Week 1
February 2004, Week 5
February 2004, Week 4
February 2004, Week 3
February 2004, Week 2
February 2004, Week 1
January 2004, Week 5
January 2004, Week 4
January 2004, Week 3
January 2004, Week 2
January 2004, Week 1
December 2003, Week 5
December 2003, Week 4
December 2003, Week 3
December 2003, Week 2
December 2003, Week 1
November 2003, Week 5
November 2003, Week 4
November 2003, Week 3
November 2003, Week 2
November 2003, Week 1
October 2003, Week 5
October 2003, Week 4
October 2003, Week 3
October 2003, Week 2
October 2003, Week 1
September 2003, Week 5
September 2003, Week 4
September 2003, Week 3
September 2003, Week 2
September 2003, Week 1
August 2003, Week 5
August 2003, Week 4
August 2003, Week 3
August 2003, Week 2
August 2003, Week 1
July 2003, Week 5
July 2003, Week 4
July 2003, Week 3
July 2003, Week 2
July 2003, Week 1
June 2003, Week 5
June 2003, Week 4
June 2003, Week 3
June 2003, Week 2
June 2003, Week 1
May 2003, Week 5
May 2003, Week 4
May 2003, Week 3
May 2003, Week 2
May 2003, Week 1
April 2003, Week 5
April 2003, Week 4
April 2003, Week 3
April 2003, Week 2
April 2003, Week 1
March 2003, Week 5
March 2003, Week 4
March 2003, Week 3
March 2003, Week 2
March 2003, Week 1
February 2003, Week 4
February 2003, Week 3
February 2003, Week 2
February 2003, Week 1
January 2003, Week 5
January 2003, Week 4
January 2003, Week 3
January 2003, Week 2
January 2003, Week 1
December 2002, Week 5
December 2002, Week 4
December 2002, Week 3
December 2002, Week 2
December 2002, Week 1
November 2002, Week 5
November 2002, Week 4
November 2002, Week 3
November 2002, Week 2
November 2002, Week 1
October 2002, Week 5
October 2002, Week 4
October 2002, Week 3
October 2002, Week 2
October 2002, Week 1
September 2002, Week 5
September 2002, Week 4
September 2002, Week 3
September 2002, Week 2
September 2002, Week 1
August 2002, Week 5
August 2002, Week 4
August 2002, Week 3
August 2002, Week 2
August 2002, Week 1
July 2002, Week 5
July 2002, Week 4
July 2002, Week 3
July 2002, Week 2
July 2002, Week 1
June 2002, Week 5
June 2002, Week 4
June 2002, Week 3
June 2002, Week 2
June 2002, Week 1
May 2002, Week 5
May 2002, Week 4
May 2002, Week 3
May 2002, Week 2
May 2002, Week 1
April 2002, Week 5
April 2002, Week 4
April 2002, Week 3
April 2002, Week 2
April 2002, Week 1
March 2002, Week 5
March 2002, Week 4
March 2002, Week 3
March 2002, Week 2
March 2002, Week 1
February 2002, Week 4
February 2002, Week 3
February 2002, Week 2
February 2002, Week 1
January 2002, Week 5
January 2002, Week 4
January 2002, Week 3
January 2002, Week 2
January 2002, Week 1
December 2001, Week 5
December 2001, Week 4
December 2001, Week 3
December 2001, Week 2
December 2001, Week 1
November 2001, Week 5
November 2001, Week 4
November 2001, Week 3
November 2001, Week 2
November 2001, Week 1
October 2001, Week 5
October 2001, Week 4
October 2001, Week 3
October 2001, Week 2
October 2001, Week 1
September 2001, Week 5
September 2001, Week 4
September 2001, Week 3
September 2001, Week 2
September 2001, Week 1
August 2001, Week 5
August 2001, Week 4
August 2001, Week 3
August 2001, Week 2
August 2001, Week 1
July 2001, Week 5
July 2001, Week 4
July 2001, Week 3
July 2001, Week 2
July 2001, Week 1
June 2001, Week 5
June 2001, Week 4
June 2001, Week 3
June 2001, Week 2
June 2001, Week 1
May 2001, Week 5
May 2001, Week 4
May 2001, Week 3
May 2001, Week 2
May 2001, Week 1
April 2001, Week 5
April 2001, Week 4
April 2001, Week 3
April 2001, Week 2
April 2001, Week 1
March 2001, Week 5
March 2001, Week 4
March 2001, Week 3
March 2001, Week 2
March 2001, Week 1
February 2001, Week 4
February 2001, Week 3
February 2001, Week 2
February 2001, Week 1
January 2001, Week 5
January 2001, Week 4
January 2001, Week 3
January 2001, Week 2
January 2001, Week 1
December 2000, Week 5
December 2000, Week 4
December 2000, Week 3
December 2000, Week 2
December 2000, Week 1
November 2000, Week 5
November 2000, Week 4
November 2000, Week 3
November 2000, Week 2
November 2000, Week 1
October 2000, Week 5
October 2000, Week 4
October 2000, Week 3
October 2000, Week 2
October 2000, Week 1
September 2000, Week 5
September 2000, Week 4
September 2000, Week 3
September 2000, Week 2
September 2000, Week 1
August 2000, Week 5
August 2000, Week 4
August 2000, Week 3
August 2000, Week 2
August 2000, Week 1
July 2000, Week 5
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July 2000, Week 3
July 2000, Week 2
July 2000, Week 1
June 2000, Week 5
June 2000, Week 4
June 2000, Week 3
June 2000, Week 2
June 2000, Week 1
May 2000, Week 5
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May 2000, Week 2
May 2000, Week 1
April 2000, Week 5
April 2000, Week 4
April 2000, Week 3
April 2000, Week 2
April 2000, Week 1
March 2000, Week 5
March 2000, Week 4
March 2000, Week 3
March 2000, Week 2
March 2000, Week 1
February 2000, Week 5
February 2000, Week 4
February 2000, Week 3
February 2000, Week 2
February 2000, Week 1
January 2000, Week 5
January 2000, Week 4
January 2000, Week 3
January 2000, Week 2
January 2000, Week 1
December 1999, Week 5
December 1999, Week 4
December 1999, Week 3
December 1999, Week 2
December 1999, Week 1
November 1999, Week 5
November 1999, Week 4
November 1999, Week 3
November 1999, Week 2
November 1999, Week 1
October 1999, Week 5
October 1999, Week 4
October 1999, Week 3
October 1999, Week 2
October 1999, Week 1
September 1999, Week 5
September 1999, Week 4
September 1999, Week 3
September 1999, Week 2
September 1999, Week 1
August 1999, Week 5
August 1999, Week 4
August 1999, Week 3
August 1999, Week 2
August 1999, Week 1
July 1999, Week 5
July 1999, Week 4
July 1999, Week 3
July 1999, Week 2
July 1999, Week 1
June 1999, Week 5
June 1999, Week 4
June 1999, Week 3
June 1999, Week 2
June 1999, Week 1
May 1999, Week 5
May 1999, Week 4
May 1999, Week 3
May 1999, Week 2
May 1999, Week 1
April 1999, Week 5
April 1999, Week 4
April 1999, Week 3
April 1999, Week 2
April 1999, Week 1
March 1999, Week 5
March 1999, Week 4
March 1999, Week 3
March 1999, Week 2
March 1999, Week 1
February 1999, Week 5
February 1999, Week 4
February 1999, Week 3
February 1999, Week 2
February 1999, Week 1
January 1999, Week 5
January 1999, Week 4
January 1999, Week 3
January 1999, Week 2
January 1999, Week 1
December 1998, Week 5
December 1998, Week 4
December 1998, Week 3
December 1998, Week 2
December 1998, Week 1
November 1998, Week 5
November 1998, Week 4
November 1998, Week 3
November 1998, Week 2
November 1998, Week 1
October 1998, Week 5
October 1998, Week 4
October 1998, Week 3
October 1998, Week 2
October 1998, Week 1
September 1998, Week 5
September 1998, Week 4
September 1998, Week 3

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