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CONLANG  July 2017, Week 1

CONLANG July 2017, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Afterward/ba9dain provenance

From:

Daniel Prohaska <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 6 Jul 2017 09:43:14 +0200

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (74 lines)

I remember my cousin from Manchester (the one in the UK ;-)), saying to her brother in church because he wouldn’t stop teasing her… “You’re dead after!”
Dan



> On 6 Jul 2017, at 09:31, Eyal Minsky-Fenick <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> 
> This is another difference between en-UK and en-US. Confused the heck out
> of me the first time I saw it. In English as spoken outside the UK, ‘after’
> cannot be a conjunction.
> 
> On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 09:01 Christa Hansberry <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> 
>> Well, for what it's worth, I personally would not understand "I went to the
>> chemist ... after ... I went to the post office", as anything other than "I
>> went to the chemist after I went to the post office", in other words, "I
>> went to the post office, and then went to the chemist". Maybe the usage is
>> different in another region (I'm from the Pacific Northwest region of the
>> US), but if I wanted to say I went to the chemist first, I would definitely
>> say "afterwards" or "then", not "after" (I also suspect that "chemist" here
>> refers to what I would call a pharmacist, but that's beside the point).
>> 
>> -Christa
>> 
>> On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 11:36 PM, stewart fraser <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Does anybody here know Arabic. In Arabic, ba9d means “after” and ba9dain
>>> means “afterwards” … I would like to know the etymology of the -“ain” in
>>> ba9dain (I presume that if you go back far enough ba9d will mean
>> “behind”).
>>> 
>>> I find English to be a bit weird when it comes to “after” and
>>> “afterwards”. Well after is a preposition … as in “after I went to the
>>> chemist, I went to the post office”. But it can also be a conjunction …
>> as
>>> in “I went to the chemist … after … I went to the post office”
>>> 
>>> Now it’s form as a conjunction can either be “afterwards” or “after that”
>>> or just “after” with a small pause after it. It seems to me that “this
>>> small pause” is acting as anaphora … it is referring back to “I went to
>> the
>>> chemist”.
>>> 
>>> Note that is this small pause disappeard (or maybe I should say if the
>>> intonation changed) you would have “I went to the chemist after I went to
>>> the post office” which is the exact opposite to “I went to the chemist …
>>> after … I went to the post office” (as many people use comma’s because
>> they
>>> look nice, rather than faithfully reflecting pauses (or potential pauses)
>>> in speech … this must cause havoc with automatic translating programs)
>>> 
>>> In my conlang I would like to make the anaphora element explicit rather
>>> than relying on pauses.
>>> 
>>> If English used the form “afterwards” as a conjunction exclusively I
>> would
>>> like it better (more logical). I read that -“wards” originally came from
>>> *wer, P.I.E. for “to turn”. I don’t really see what lead to its
>>> grammaticization thu’. Also I don’t really see what function it is
>>> performing (or did perform at one time). Anybody got any ideas ?
>>> 
>>>                                                       … Stewart Fraser
>>> 
>> 
> -- 
> Eyal Joseph Minsky-Fenick
> [log in to unmask] (personal)
> [log in to unmask] (school)
> 203-393-1394 (home)
> 203-988-2234 (cell)
> 9 Birch Rd., Woodbridge, CT 06525

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