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CONLANG  February 2018, Week 4

CONLANG February 2018, Week 4

Subject:

Re: Restrictive vs. Non-restrictive adjectives?

From:

Stewart Fraser <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 1 Mar 2018 10:45:35 +0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (72 lines)

Yeah … “throw away” wasn’t really the right choice of words.

> On Mar 1, 2018, at 9:41 AM, MorphemeAddict <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> 
> Addressing only the very last point, re "throw away" swear words: I think
> such words are used for their emotional punch rather than anything
> denotive. As such, they may bear the most important information of all, and
> thus not be 'throw-away' at all.
> Because of their ability to appear in various contexts and positions in
> sentences, I agree that they aren't normal adjectives.
> 
> stevo
> 
> On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 7:13 PM, Stewart Fraser <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> 
>> Ah you are asking if non-restrictive adjectives exist. I thought you were
>> assuming their existence. I think all the posters after you (the original)
>> assumed they exist … OK, I understand.
>> 
>> I am pretty sure they don’t exist … in any language that I know of anyway.
>> 
>> Lets give an example (to keep us grounded in reality instead of flights of
>> fancy which some latinate term might send us) …
>> 
>> Say I was telling an amusing story about a/the “big black dog” and a/the
>> “small white dog”. Half way through the tale I wouldn’t suddenly give the
>> information that the big dog was angry by mentioning “big black angry dog”.
>> I would posit that the reason for this is … if something is worth saying it
>> is worth saying properly. To slip in “angry” does not give enough “phonetic
>> weight” (my term). A seperate clause or a relative clause such as “the
>> black dog which was angry” or “the black dog which was very angry by the
>> way” gives sufficient weight to this extra bit of information you are
>> adding.
>> 
>> Relative clauses and adjectives have similar rolls is sentences. But
>> usuage is not identical. For example often the easiest (or only) way to
>> refer to an individual on the very edge of your social circle (i.e.
>> knowledge) is to use a relative clause whose main concept is a verb (as
>> opposed to copula + adjective) … i.e. “that guy who kicked my dog”
>> 
>> Now I am going to contradict myself … but I think this is a very minor
>> usage and doesn’t nullify my main argument. Sometime during the tail I
>> could suddenly refer to the “small shitty white dog”. However “shitty” is
>> not really giving more information about the dog … rather it is showing
>> that I disapprove of the dog or something that the dog done. A swear word
>> is a bit “throw away” word … not on the same level as a normal adjective.
>> 
>> … Stewart
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 1, 2018, at 7:49 AM, Logan Kearsley <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 28 February 2018 at 16:28, Stewart Fraser <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>>> I have never heard of a restrictive adjective or a non-restrictive
>> adjective. Does English have this dichotomy ? Any examples.
>>> 
>>> No. At least, not in the same sense as those terms apply to relative
>>> clauses (per And, apparently there is another usage of the same terms
>>> for adjectives). That's why I was asking. Quoth myself:
>>> 
>>>>> In contrast, there is no way to distinguish restrictive vs.
>>>>> non-restrictive adjectives (apart from relativizing a predicate
>>>>> adjective clause) in English.
>>> 
>>> -l.
>> 

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