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CONLANG  April 2018, Week 3

CONLANG April 2018, Week 3

Subject:

Re: case systems in your languages

From:

Pete Bleackley <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

[log in to unmask]

Date:

Sat, 21 Apr 2018 07:00:56 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (150 lines)

It wouldn't be unusual for one of the other cases to double up in meaning.

>----Original message----
>From : [log in to unmask]
>Date : 21/04/2018 - 03:11 (BST)
>To : [log in to unmask]
>Subject : Re: case systems in your languages
>
>Lortho currently has ten cases:
>
>1. Nominative (subject)
>2. Accusative (direct object)
>3. Dative (indirect object)
>4. Genitive (possessor)
>5. Lative (movement in/into)
>6. Ablative (movement from/out of)
>7. Allative (movement to/towards)
>8. Prolative (movement through/via)
>9. Instrumental (using/with)
>10. Vocative (address)
>
>After listing these and reading through the other responses, I realized
>there is a gap. While I have the cases for movement towards, into, out of,
>or through, I do not have the locative case. You'd think that with all this
>movement stuff that location would be rather important.
>
>very respectfully,
>
>Brian B. Bourque
>SFC, USA (Ret)
>[log in to unmask]
>
>"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to
>stick to possibilities; Truth isn't." - Mark Twain
>___________________
>http://lortho.conlang.org
>
>
>On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 12:30 PM, Jyri Lehtinen <[log in to unmask]>
>wrote:
>
>> Here's where the case system of Kišta has converged over the years:
>>
>> 1. Nominative - The unmarked base form, prototypically grammatical
>> subjects, adnominal modifiers (including possessors), and postpositional
>> complements. I have no doubt that it'll also find a lot of use for the
>> subjects and objects of non-finite dependent clauses once I get to working
>> on them.
>> 2. Accusative - The direct object
>> 3. Focus - The case used for subjects, objects and human recipients in the
>> main clause when falling in narrow argument focus. It descends from an
>> older ablative and there are still adverbs in the language which
>> incorporate it into their form.
>> 4. Lative - General movement to or towards and recipients
>> 5. Illative - Movement into a concrete location or up to a point. I may
>> also give it secondary meanings of a purposive and change of state case.
>> 6. Locative - Location at
>> 7. Ablative - Movement from
>> 8. Instrumental - Tools as well as well as movement through. I may restrict
>> this secondary prolative use at least dialectally to a set list of
>> topographic nouns, though.
>> 9. Caritive - Lack of
>>
>> Postpositions are relational nouns in Kišta and the local postpositions
>> typically have their own defective locative case paradigms. The most recent
>> developments of the noun case paradigm haven't reached the postpositions,
>> so the local postpositions preserve a more archaic state of the
>> lative-locative-ablative triad.
>>
>> There's also a set of orientative suffixes that come before the locative
>> case suffixes on nouns. These originate from agglutinated local
>> postpositions and thus the locative cases they take are directly related to
>> the postpositional case paradigm instead of following the regular noun
>> cases.
>>
>> For Janti I've had the idea of a three case paradigm of a nominative,
>> oblique, and locative, with a comitative maybe added diaectally. Here the
>> unmarked nominative is basically the case of core arguments and oblique the
>> typical case of various obliques. The oblique case can also be used for
>> high animacy objects if they can't be disambiguated from the subject verb
>> morphology or context. Both the oblique and locative cases are used for all
>> sorts of local meanings. The locative case will probably lean more towards
>> locative and ablative meanings than the oblique case but I intend to make
>> their distribution somewhat random and ultimately lexically determined by
>> the choice of the verb. This is, however, something where I haven't written
>> down anything concrete yet.
>>
>>    -Jyri
>>
>>
>> 2018-04-19 14:58 GMT+02:00 Katerina <[log in to unmask]>:
>>
>> > not sure whether there already is a thread for this or not - what case
>> > systems do your languages use?
>> >
>> > the one for T'elχ isn't complete yet, but i decided that the meanings of
>> > the cases should resemble a combination of the chukchi and itelmen case
>> > systems because i am partial to both (for some reason).
>> >
>> > orientative-dative [to, for]: used for physical movement toward an object
>> > or in a particular direction, or to mark the recipient or beneficiary of
>> an
>> > action
>> > determinative [by; at, near, around]: used for the physical location or
>> > direction of movement (with an object serving as a landmark), or for an
>> > entity or object that serves as an example, model or framework for
>> another
>> > entity/object
>> > causal/narrative [because of, for the purpose of, for the reason that;
>> of,
>> > about, regarding]: used to mark the cause or goal of an action or the
>> > subject of a story (narrative)
>> > designative [as, for, instead of; as, like, similar to; for, in order
>> to]:
>> > used to state a role or purpose or to express the resemblance between one
>> > entity or object and another
>> > translative [into]: used for an entity or object that is transformed or
>> > turned into a different entity/object (as in "the human being was made
>> > T'elχ")
>> > abessive/privative/caritive [without]: used to state the absence or lack
>> of
>> > an entity or object
>> > ablative [away from]: used for physical movement away from an object or
>> in
>> > the opposite direction, or for an entity or object that loses or is
>> > deprived of something
>> > instrumental [using, by means of, with]: used for an instrument or means
>> > whereby an action is performed, may mark the agent or the patient (or
>> both
>> > simultaneously)
>> > comitative I [with, together with, along with]: used for joint actions;
>> > connotes inseparability, used for inalienable parts of a whole, or
>> persons)
>> > (circumfix)
>> > comitative II [with, together with, along with]: used for joint actions
>> or
>> > actions that require the presence of a specific object; connotes
>> > separability, used for objects and entities not considered "persons")
>> > (circumfix)
>> > locative [in, within, inside]: used for physical location in the most
>> > general sense, has a variety of figurative meanings
>> > vocative: used to address a sapient entity directly
>> >
>> > peace,
>> >
>> > cathy
>> >
>>
>

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