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CONLANG  April 2019, Week 5

CONLANG April 2019, Week 5

Subject:

Re: Have

From:

Aidan Aannestad <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 30 Apr 2019 09:19:35 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (72 lines)

One of the more fun ways I've seen to express 'have' without a verb 
comes from Mayan languages, where head-marked possession lets you do 
something really easy:

/k'o nu-ch'aweb'al
/exist 1sg-phone
'I have a phone' (lit. 'my phone exists' / 'there is my phone'; example 
from K'ichee')

It seems so satisfyingly simple.

AFAMC Emihtazuu has no verb for 'have' - it uses a benefactive + 'exist' 
construction - but it did lose an original verb for 'have' early in its 
history. That verb now only remains as the grammaticalisation source for 
an affix 'can do'.

On 2019/04/30 7:07, Jim Hopkins wrote:
> To have “have” or not to have “have”, that is the question. Not that I have any problem having “have”, but if I don’t have to have “have” maybe I just won’t have “have”.
>
> PS, Itlani does have “have” – lafiya. It is never used as an auxiliary. And there other ways of expressing possession by using the dative case.
>
> Itlani Jim
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Raymond Brown
> Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2019 4:38 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Have
>
> On 29/04/2019 13:19, taliesin the storyteller wrote:
>> On 4/29/19 1:06 PM, C. Brickner wrote:
>>> I'm also thinking of not having the  verb "to have" in the sense
>>> of possession, alienable or inalienable. The subject and the
>>> direct object alone mark the concept of possession.
>> A verb for "to have is much more common among conlangs than
>> natlangs, at least among those conlangs in CALS. (Natlangs in CALS
>> are only those with 50 features in WALS or more.)
>>
>> http://cals.info/feature/117/
> Doesn't that rather reflect that most of the conlang creators were/are
> SAE speakers?     :)
>
>> WALS has some info on what non-having languages have instead.
>>
>> https://wals.info/chapter/117
> WALS map shows clear that having a verb "to have" is a SAE feature.  :)
> https://wals.info/feature/117A#2/16.6/153.6
>
> TAKE must necessarily have verb "to have" as it's simply ancient Greek
> without inflexions.
>
> Outidic has a verb "to have" (keskai) probabably because Dr Outis was an
> SAE speaker.   :)
> I notice Philippe Labbé's "Universalis Universalis" also has a verb "to
> have" (abe), almost certaily for the same reason.
>
> Of course Britainese will have to have a verb "to have" (possibly _avair_).
>
> But Brx at present doesn't have a verb "to have" and when the Predicates
> page is revised it is still not likely to have such a verb.  At present
> it has what WALS calls 'topic possessive' if what is possessed is
> indefinite, but "locational possessive" if the possessum is definite.
> This is likely to remain so.
>
> Ray


---
このEメールはアバスト アンチウイルスによりウイルススキャンされています。
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

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