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CONLANG  May 2019, Week 4

CONLANG May 2019, Week 4

Subject:

Talking about specificness (was Re: Word = Clause?)

From:

Stewart Fraser <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 25 May 2019 16:06:22 +0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (59 lines)

Some thoughts on specificness.

I guess the tripartite system of definite, specific, and non-specific will be adequate to describe J.Jones’s language. 

And posted the definitions of these terms as they appear on wikipedia.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definiteness <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definiteness>>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specificity_(linguistics) <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specificity_(linguistics)>>

and adds “differences in definition of terms are legion”. My preference is to totally disregard these terms and make up my own system (which I find “neater”). A person who understands my system can of course work out the correspondence between it and what they understand by such terms as spcific, referential etc.

I will introduce my system here … hopefully some will find it food for thought. Perhaps I will end up amending it after it is commented on.

======================================

The noun in question can be either specific or non-specific to the speaker. (2 choices)

The speaker can consider the hearer to know the noun in question specifically, to not know the noun in question specifically, or the speaker can be ignorant about how the listener knows the noun in question (3 choices)

So logically we have 6 situations here ( 2 x 3 ). Now no language has grammaticized these 6 situations. We are definitely looking at specificness too closely. But it is useful to take such a close look, and after to zoom out and see how the two or three demarkations of an actual languge fit over this fine mesh we have envisioned above.

Now would be a good time to introduce my notation. A week or two ago Logan brought up the fact that Algebra would in no way be the useful tool it is today without the notation developed in the 15th century (?) which allows us to manipulate terms. In a similar vein I present my notation for specificness …

Each term will begin with a capital S (maybe meaning "situation" or "in the situation" ... it doesn't really matter). Then there will follow 2 or 3 values.  

The first value will be "1" if the item is specific for the 1st person, "0" if not so.

The second value  "1" if the item is specific for the 2nd person, "0" if not so. If the speaker does not know we have an "X". 

So … some examples of this notation.

door is [S 1 1] in ……….. “The door is open”

pint is [S 0 0] in ……….. “Could you buy me a pint”

girl is [S 1 0] in ………  “During my trip to Budapest I met this really nice girl"

guy is [S 1 X] in ……… "Do you know that/the guy that got drunk last night ?" 
                        (In this case the speaker can identify* the guy)

guy is [S 0 X] ……… "Do you know that/the guy that got drunk last night ?" 
                        (In this case the speaker can not identify the guy)

Now it can be seen that some situations are more likely to exist than others. [S 0 1] is highly unusual. In fact you could say that for all intents and purposes, it doesn’t exist.

I guess the above encompasses all that might be involved in what is called the definite/indefinite distinction.

A neat way to expand the above system and include what the specific/non-specific distinction usually involves is to add an extra value for a person who is neither the speaker or the hearer. I make this value 

A third person could exist or not exist, if they exist, the speaker can consider this third person to know the noun in question specifically, to not know the noun in question specifically, or the speaker can be ignorant about how this third person knows the noun in question. (4 choices).

For example “She wants to marry a Norwegian” could be [S 0 0 0] or [S 0 0 1] depending on whether she has a particular Norwegian in mind or not (I am assuming that [S 1 0 1] would be expressed as  “She wants to marry this Norwegian” with the conversation probably continuing in such a manner that the hearer gets quite a bit information about the Norwegian. This is a probability though and not a rule)

Any thoughts ?

… Stewart

*And when I say identify. I mean put a face to that which is referred to (in the case where the referred to is human. They say “man is the measure of all things” {people are mainly interested in other people}so this is how I will define “identify”)

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