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AUXLANG  January 1998, Week 3

AUXLANG January 1998, Week 3

Subject:

Re: Jespersen's response to criticism (was: "Hilok" vs. "seliger")

From:

"Raymond A. Brown" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 18 Jan 1998 17:21:13 GMT

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (99 lines)

At 12:54 17/1/98, Bruce R. Gilson wrote:
>Ray Brown wrote:
>
>>And how unlike Jespersen whose mantel they purport to wear.  If only they
>>cared to read the Novialiste, they'd find that J was not adverse to
>>criticism, considered it carefully and always replied in a gentlemanly way,
>>whether he agreed or not.
>
>I may not be quite the gentleman Jespersen was,
 
Something else we are agreed on.  :-)
<please note the smiley>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
At this point I interrupt my reply to Bruce to say that as from the end of
THIS reply, I am joining the list of auxlangers/conlangers who will not get
drawn into argument with BRG.
 
Someone said he prefers BRG to ML.  Not me!  At least with Mark I know
where I am; his arguments are (almost unremittingly) logical; I understand
him when he writes on liguistic matters - indeed, I have sometimes learnt
from him - and I understand his phonology.  And, in my experience, he has a
sense of humor.
 
If (like me, in fact) you tired of the exchange, close & trash the mail
now. If you want to read the last & _final_ chapter in this exchange, read
on.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
[.....]
>when someone calls me a hypocrite, (admittedly, this has been withdrawn, but
>some of my posts were made before this was done)
 
I'm genuinely sorry that although I made a _public_ apology, you seem
unwilling to drop the matter.  If you _must_ keep rehashing old arguments,
please have the goodness to put them into context.  From where I stand your
criticism of IL's SELEGER is substantially the same as mine of N98's HILOK.
 
 
If I merely substitute 'double-think' for 'prejudice', and 'hypocricy' for
'racism', then I think Philip Jonsson puts it well:
"I must say that I find this kind of reasoning (if reason it can be called)
to smack of double-think, or outright hypocricy.  The difference is only
one of how consciously one holds these views."
 
I was generous enough to make a public apology.  I'm sorry you do not seem
entirely to believe me.
 
>or totally (and it would
>seem, willfully) distorts my comments, I cannot be so generous.
 
I have not _totally_ distorted any of your arguments; and I have *NEVER*
willfully distorted any of your arguments.  These are (deliberate?)
untruths.
 
Indeed, I think I have been over-patient in trying to follow your arguments
which, I must confess, I have not always found easy.
 
[......]
>
>If I wanted to be as caustic as I could be, I could point to spelling errors
>in your posts, for example.
 
How patronizing!
 
Folks - if you respond to Bruce, don't forget to proof-read your email.
<no smiley - this is not a joke>
 
I'm sorry - with the present number of postings on conlang & auxlang I
simply do not have time even to read them all, let alone proof-read my
replies.  Most people accept what Jack Durst calls "Net English".  Even I
never dreamt you'd be so petty as to make the sort of remark you've made
above.
 
>Not only have I NOT done so, I've never done any-
>thing as bad as (ok, you AFTERWARD said it was a joke, but that was not
>clear at the time)
 
Judging by my private emails, the joke was clear to some others at least.
 
>to deliberately misconstrue your statement and throw it back at me
>as in my reference to "post-1930 Novial" for example.
 
Er - doesn't 1998 come _after_ 1930?  Or is also your math(s) different
from mine?
 
But how anyone could take my remark as a deliberate misconstruction of your
statement to throw back at you seems almost incredible to me.  This side of
the Atlantic, humor is often used as a deliberate ploy to defuse a
situation that might otherwise get unpleasant.
 
I recall once, someone replied to you: 'Act your age'.  To which I say
"Amen'.  You seem to take everything personally & want to trade personal
insults.
 
I simply cannot waste time (& exhaust my patience) trying to conduct
reasoned, _objective_ argument on these terms.
 
Adieu,
Ray.

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