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CONLANG  November 1998, Week 1

CONLANG November 1998, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Why we don't discuss auxlangs on CONLANG list

From:

"Robert J. Petry" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 5 Nov 1998 08:08:03 -0700

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (87 lines)

Bryan Maloney wrote:

> On Thu, 5 Nov 1998, Rick Morneau wrote:
>
> [kut]
>
> In that case, IALers aren't trying to sell, they're trying to perform
> religious conversions.  I deal with a lot of company representatives, and
> they're always happy to get an earful from me regarding their products.
> They know that, if they can improve their product, they'll get more sales.

Some of this may be true. Only having been following and participating in this
arena for under two years, I still don't have a complete feel for the
reactions of people to these topics.
However, I was a salesman for years. And, yes, the salesman always wants to
hear from the client, or potential client, since that means money in the
pocket. I'm not sure IALers are looking to get money in their pockets.
And, the basic sales strategy of a salesman is to get the customer talking or
acting in a favorable mood toward his product. And, if that means the customer
is making positive suggestions, that's great, because the customer is now
telling the salesman how to sell him or her. And, at the right moment, when
the custome is in a positive buying mood, pop the question and separate some
money from the customer.
The idea is to get the customer saying yes, yes, yes, this is good, yes I
would like that, and while they are saying yes, instead of no, slip in an "ok
I'll write you up an order, ok?" Yes, the customers says before he realizes
what has happened. At least, that's what all the sales classes, courses,
books, articles, etc. teach. It's called "sales technique".

The IALer, sad to say, does not know these techniques nor do they try to use
them as far as I've seen here on conlang or auxlang.

> > In the early days of this list, I pointed out what I considered to be
> > flaws in some auxlangs.  The result was long heated arguments that got
> > nowhere except to cause a lot of bad feelings.

I think there are various reasons for this. And, some of it comes from how a
"flaw" is presented. I've noticed since being on the net, that all lists
mention the term "flamming", not just the two we usually mention here. Why is
that? Because it is easy to get into heated discussion on the net and forget
that all the other people see are words on a white or colored background. They
have no feeling, movement, vibes, etc. For instance, "you're BAD" and you know
it. Now, as you know, this is a simple example of how the word bad can mean
good, but, we usually can tell what is meant by the presence of the person
we're talking with. But, to just read that, and maybe in the middle of
something that is a "heavy" debate, could set off all kinds of emotions. So,
these arguments are not unique to conlang or auxlang.

> And when I point out the flaws in a product to a salesman, he takes note,
> and sometimes the product has been changed to suit.

Of course, he wants your money so he can stick some commission in his pocket.
That actually is his job, to agree with the customer and make changes where
possible, so the customer will buy. If the changes can't be made, the salesman
promises to do all he can. That's fair for now isn't it Mr. Jones? Good, may I
write the order for you then? Excellent, what is your middle initial?....

Neither conlangers or auxlangers, to my knowledge, on these lists want your
money. So, what do they want? What do I want? What do you want? I want
positive input and honest questions? Versus, that won't work, it doesn't suit
my perspective, or people won't accept it, it's too passive, too eurocentric,
etc. If we can find out what each person wants, and what would help them with
their project, that might cut down on some of the "arguments". However, there
is an opposite side to that too. My idea is better than your idea so I can't
help you develop yours, I have to show you why mine is better. So, here's the
deal, you should ...... Or, listen, Joe, your lin has this flaw and that flaw,
but don't tell me why I am wrong about this.

So, the answer to "arguments"? Just like the sun coming up every day, (or the
world turning if you want to tell me the sun doesn't come up ;--)) ) there
will be "arguments". And, we can hide behind the screen you're reading this
on, never to be held personally accountable for our spiels. Only a name in
cyberspace.

> > And then the fighting begins.
>
> That's because so many IALers are simply irrational fanatics, not
> attempting to produce a perfectable product.

Or, are they? Exceptions in language grammar, etc. are sometimes necessary
because of the nature of the function of the human brain. That's why one now
deceased "IALer" refused to remove them all from his language. His research
showed some were needed to make a language living, etc.

Al l sue,
Bob, x+

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