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CONLANG  December 1998, Week 2

CONLANG December 1998, Week 2

Subject:

Mandarin & Nootka (was: Re: Nouns, verbs, adjecti

From:

"Mathias M. Lassailly" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Constructed Languages List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 12 Dec 1998 07:35:08 -0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (106 lines)

Matt wrote :


> When people make claims that language X doesn't distinguish nouns from
> verbs syntactically, the often overlook morphology.  Speaking of which,
> here's what Paul Schachter has to say on Nootka ("Language Typology and
> Syntactic Description", vol. 1, pp. 11-12):
>
> BEGINNING OF QUOTE:
>
snip


>
> (1)     Mamu:k-ma           qu:'as-'i
>         working-Pres.Indic  man-Def
>         "The man is working"
>
> (2)     Qu:'as-ma       mamu:k-'i
>         man-Pres.Indic  working-Def
>         "The working-one is a man"
>

snip

 Thus there is evidence that Nootka tense morphemes, such
> as -MA in (1) and (2), are best analyzed as clitics that attach to the
> clause-initial word, *whatever* category this word belongs to....
>

let's say... predicative topical ?

looks like words show either a generic or an agent noun and the agent noun is also the morphem of the verb with no copula and operator implied :

Japanese : ni juu ichi = 2 10 1 where * * is either x or +
This is my first step to adapt your math and figures stuff. Impressive, isn't it ?

*man* = 1. man (gen); 2. agent who pertains to such category (identitive); 3. to pertain to such category (verb). Implied operator : *to pertain to the category of*.

*work* = 1. work (gen); 2. result in, or substantive of, experience *working* (actance); 3. to obtain or perform such result or actance (verb). Implied operator : *to perform*.

Some famous Nootka examples :

He manned the ship with crewmen.
I've been working all night long to finish my work.

I suggest a strong proto-historic relation between Nootka and English. And Danove"n and Shan too (especially Shan which works exactly like that).

May I ask :

1. whether there is a clitic xxx to mark a theme (topic) that is not the predicate of the clause :

mamu:k(-i)-xxx qu:'as
man-top/arg work-pred

qu:'as-xxx mamu:k
*work-top/arg man-pred


> END OF QUOTE.
>
> So the moral of the story is that while nouns and verbs in Nootka
> are *distributionally* similar, they are *morphosyntactically*
> distinct in ways which allow us to distinguish two classes of words
> on purely structural (non-semantic) grounds.  Nootka may be unusually
> generous in allowing nouns to behave as verbs and verbs to behave
> as nouns, but there are still two separate classes.
>
> Incidentally, pairs like (1) and (2) can also be found in Malagasy,
> for which there is ample evidence for distinguishing nouns from verbs
> syntactically:
>
> (5)     Miasa  ny   lehilahy
>         works  the  man
>         "The man works"
>
> (6)     Lehilahy  ny   miasa
>         man       the  works
>         "The one who works (is) a man"
>
> No linguist would ever claim that there is no noun-verb distinction
> in Malagasy.  It is simply the case that you can convert any verb phrase
> into a noun phrase by adding the determiner NY "the" (some people call
> these 'headless relative clauses'):
>
>         mipetraka  any    amin'ny  tanana
>         live       there  in-the   city
>         "live in the city"
>
>         ny   mipetraka  any    amin'ny  tanana
>         the  live       there  in-the   city
>         "the one(s) who live in the city"
>         "those who live in the city"
>
> cf.:    ny   olona   mipetraka  any    amin'ny  tanana
>         the  people  live       there  in-the   city
>         "the people who live in the city"
>
> Matt.
>
>
Mathias

-----
See the original message at http://www.egroups.com/list/conlang/?start=19201

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