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AUXLANG  November 1999, Week 2

AUXLANG November 1999, Week 2

Subject:

Re: Interlingua - Asian

From:

"Donald J. HARLOW" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

International Auxiliary Languages <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 9 Nov 1999 16:04:43 -0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (158 lines)

Je 01:02 ptm 11/9/99 -0500, vi skribis
 
>Don wrote (replying to someone else (Leo Moser?):
>
> > From my point of view, in the long run it doesn't really matter to >=20
> the ultimate user=3D20
> > whether a single source language (e.g. English) contributes the
> > vocabulary,
> > or it is proportionally taken from all the languages of the world. >=20
> There are other, more important factors to consider.
>
>That's your view, but I don't think it was Zamenhof's. If it had been,
>Esperanto would have ended up on the interlinguistic junk heap
>with Sol-re-sol. Apart from the "logical languages", which are
>a different kettle of fish, there's long been general agreement
>that a practical IAL will have a Romance bias, due to the character
>of the most widely distributed international vocabulary. The
>disgreement between semi-naturalists (like Esperantists) and ultra-
>naturalists (like Interlinguists) is over the degree of this bias.
 
Such agreement does seem to exist -- the question is, how valid is it. As I=
=20
remember, Interlingua used English as one of the languages on which it=20
based its widely distributed international vocabulary. The results may be=20
seen in the example we've been quoting, from which I've extracted words=20
(and a few simple expressions) for purposes of comparison. Here's the list.=
=20
My question is: for the speaker of English, which of the two comparison=20
languages has the more "international" (in the sense of being congruent=20
with English, and so comprehensible) vocabulary?
 
ENGLISH         INTERLINGUA             INTERCONTINENTAL
 
the sun         le sol                  mata-hari
say(s)/tell(s)  dice                    yu
my name is              io me appella           wo-ti nama -*)
I                       io                      wo
am                      es                      -
very                    multo                   taihen
brilliant               brillante               brillante
I rise          io me leva              wo leva wo
in                      al                      a
east                    est                     est
and                     e                       dan
when                    quando                  toki
it is                   il es                   ada
day                     die                     hari
look                    reguarda                miru
through         per                     per
your                    tu                      ni-ti
window          fenestra                fenestra
with                    con                     sama
my                      mi                      wo-ti
eye                     oculo                   mata
as bright as            brillante como  brillante como
gold                    auro                    kin
you                     te                      ni
time                    tempore         tempo
to get up               a levar te              a levar ni
lazy                    pigro                   sust
not                     non                     non
shine                   brilla                  brilla
so that         a fin que               sam-rap
stay                    resta                   tomaru
bed                     lecto                   toko
sleep                   dormir                  nemuru
but                     sed                     sed
work                    labora                  suru kam(?)
read                    lege                    yomu
walk                    promena         aruku
 
Answer is, of course, six of one ... half dozen of the other.
 
Obviously, this particular passage (chosen by Gode) doesn't address the=20
very real advantages of the truly international part of Interlingua's=20
vocabulary. The problem is that, at least in English (and, in my limited=20
experience, in other languages as well), very few real passages would. The=
=20
most commonly used vocabulary -- and therefore the one that you find most=20
commonly in real exchanges of information -- has evolved in different=20
directions since the sack of Rome. Heck, that can occur in a very short=20
period of time -- the best example is the great divergence between=20
automotive terms in Great Britain and the United States.
 
For the benefit of the interested, here's another of my occasional postings=
=20
of multilingual instructions for modern technological marvels, to=20
demonstrate the wonders of the international vocabulary. This one (in=20
English, French and German) comes off the instruction sheet for my cheap=20
Oregon Scientific pocket organizer; I happen to carry this sheet around in=
=20
my shirt pocket. I've added Esperanto equivalents for the three sentences;=
=20
maybe someone would care to add a version in international Interlingua (I=20
won't insist on Gode's intercontinental version).
 
---
 
You can enter up to 96 characters for the Address field and 48 characters=20
for other fields.
Vous pouvez entrer jusqu'a` 96 caracte`res pour le champ de l'adresse et 48=
=20
pour les autres champs.
Sie ko"nnen bis zu 96 Zeichen fu"r das Addressenfeld, und 48 Zeichen fu"r=20
alle anderen Felder eingeben.
Vi povas enigi =F8is 96 literspacojn por la Adresfako kaj 48 literspacojn=
 por=20
aliaj fakoj.
 
If needed, press [SYM] to cycle through available symbol characters.
Si ne'cessaire, appuyez sur [SYM] pour circuler parmi les symboles=
 disponibles.
Falls no"tig, beta"tigen Sie [SYM], um durch die Liste der zur Verfu"gung=20
stehenden Sonderzeichen zu suchen.
Se necese, premu [SYM] por cirkuli tra disponeblaj simboloj.
 
Phone 1 and Phone 2 fields accept only - and numbers.
Les champs de Te'le'phone 1 et Te'le'phone 2 n'acceptent que - et les=
 chiffres.
In die Felder "Phone 1" und "Phone 2" sind nur numerische Eingaben=
 zula"ssig.
La fakoj "Phone 1" kaj "Phone 2" akceptas sole - kaj ciferojn.
 
---
 
Zamenhof did indeed take much of the core vocabulary of Esperanto from the=
=20
same sources as did Interlingua -- and he did, in his time, make much the=20
same argument of this vocabulary's "internationality". Fortunately, it was=
=20
not his only argument in favor of Esperanto; otherwise, Esperanto would=20
have ended up on the interlinguistic junk heap with any number of=20
"naturalistic" languages.
 
---
 
(*) Interesting to notice that for his sample of "intercontinental"=20
Interlingua Gode took the trouble to smooth out the idiosyncrasies that the=
=20
Interlingua pronoun system inherited from its sources. The pronouns=20
completely eschew both the regular agglutinated -N ending of Esperanto and=
=20
the irregularly inflected accusatives of Interlingua; and the regular=20
ending -ti, when affixed to the Chinese pronouns, replaces the inflected=20
possessives of Interlingua and seems to play the same role as the Esperanto=
=20
ending -A and the Chinese particle "de".
 
 
-- Don HARLOW
http://www.webcom.com/~donh/
(English version: http://www.webcom.com/~donh/dona.html)
 
F. Tuglas, Mira=F8o, nun legeblas (Latin-3) =E6e
   http://www.best.com/~donh/Esperanto/Literaturo/Noveloj/miragxo.html
a=FD Unikode =E6e
   http://www.best.com/~donh/Esperanto/Literaturo/Noveloj/miragxou.html

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