I accidently sent this to Kristen this morning (and then asked him to forward it but I have time to do it now). > >OK, since there is definately a difference other than > >length between the vowel in school/cool/fool/tool versus > >could/book/wool/woman, I shall henceforth use [w:] for the > >former and [u] for the latter. Any objections? > > But [w:] would still have the same status as a consonant > -- this time though its geminate. You need a vowel, so a > better one would perhaps be [w=] (syllabic [w]), but that > too is problematic since [u] is essentially a syllabic [w] > and we agreed that there is a length difference, no? [w=] sounds good to me. > Anyways, if you're sure that there's a difference in > quality as well, and we can't figure out what it is, then > I guess any symbol will do for now. In [w=], the hole in the lips is narrower than in [u]. Of course, both are rounded. > Hmmm... now I'm really having doubts as to whats happening > before /l/. I need to hear my Brisbane pals again. I suspect > your [w:] is really [u-:]. This actually makes more sense > now that I think about it. If /l/ has that effect of erasing > the [y] glide of long /u/, then [u-y] becomes [u-:] before > /l/. Remember, I don't have that diphthong. I'd use [w=] as the _ooh_ as in, "ooh, that's nice!", should anyone give me a good back massage or something. :-) Very much a prolongued consonantal [w]. I'd say the NSW pronunciation of _school_ is [skywl], compared to the SA [skw=l]. > >Can you name other English dialects in which [y] is used? > > Wild guess: Cockney. > > Its the Australian dialects that for me are characterized > by (among other things) use of [y]. Other dialects of > English haven't caught my attention in this same regard, > but they probably exist. I was listening last night (not for research purposes, no) to an English drama on cassette, and (a) all the occurences of /u/ sound just like the Australian to me, and (b) bear no resemblance to [w]. > I have added below how I recall these vowels spoken in > Brisbane. Remember that I'm not a native speaker of > Brisbane English, so you have to take this with a grain > of salt. > >air = [e:@] [e:@_^] ~ [e:] > >ear = [i:@] [i:@_^] ~ [i:] > > (Where [@_^] is a schwa with a non-syllabic diacritic) These diacritics, too complicated :-) > What about "boy" [boj] and "boil" [bojl]? Replace the [o] with the vowel in _law_. Adrian.