>>Yoon Ha, you can do a uvular flap?!?  I can do a uvular trill (having
>>learnt French briefly and stopped, I practiced the fricative in odd moments
>>and then one day in Phonetics class realised that I'd overshot) but I
>>certainly can't flap or tap back there!
>Just use the same configuration as for the trill and less breath energy.
>Stop fast.  :-)

I'm getting 2-3 trills together now ... will keep trying. :-)  But I
thought flaps were conscious movement controlled by muscles, not produced
by blowing and aerodynamics.

>>Brian: there are some tones that are harder for me than others.  I almost
>>never hit the true Mandarin tone 3 - which is
>It's really only that way when a syllable is pronounced in total
>isolation.  Otherwise the falling part of it is really not rendered.
>Fundamentally it's a low rising tone.

Yeah, but tone 3 really is mutilated in Singaporean Mandarin.  If I
pronounce it in isolation I still do it with pretty much flat contour.  And
a lot of Singaporean speakers don't even apply the tone 3 goes to 2 before
another tone 3 sandhi rule in Mandarin.  Funny, really, considering that
everyone knows to kick in the incredibly complicated tone sandhi rules for