> Date:         Wed, 7 Nov 2001 10:59:56 +0100
> From: Christophe Grandsire <[log in to unmask]>
> En réponse à David Peterson <[log in to unmask]>:
> >     I thought that [O] was just another way of writing [Q]. I was
> > under the impression that both were symbols for rounded, open-mid
> > back vowels, just that one was SAMPA and one was X-SAMPA. What do
> > these two represent?

If a sound is represented in SAMPA, it's supposed to be the same in
X-SAMPA. The X- means extended, after all.

(Since SAMPA is also intended to be used as a language-specific
phonemic transcription, you're more likely to find plain symbols like
/r/ used to approximate less obvious ones like /4/ (which is only in
X-SAMPA). But the same is routinely done with the IPA proper).

> [O]: rounded low-mid back vowel ('turned c' in IPA), the 'o' in
> French "port".
> [Q]: rounded low back vowel ('turned script a' in IPA), a rounded
> version of [A].

> Quite different sounds in my opinion, though I can understand they can be
> confused. After all, it took me 15 years to understand the difference between
> IPA 'ae-ligature' and a simple [a].

I still don't really get it --- my Danish phonemes are interfering.
/{/ ~ /a/ ~ /A/ are allophones for me, with /A/ in rhotic and velar
environments, and otherwise /{/ as long and /a/ as short.

So I know how produce all three sounds, but not in free variation, and
I'm hard put to distinguish between them in languages where they do
vary freely.

Lars Mathiesen (U of Copenhagen CS Dep) <[log in to unmask]> (Humour NOT marked)