On Thu, 6 Aug 2009 08:51:18 -0500, Matthew Turnbull <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Indeed the trill is voiceless, and the now that I think about it, it does
>have a kind of growly quality to it. Jorayn is designed for human speakers,
>and there are only a couple of consonants that use the "uvular" voice, the
>most common one I transcribe as [ʀ͡r] in IPA and [ R\r)] in CXS, it's
>unvoiced, but behaves as a voiced sound
>On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 7:28 AM, And Rosta <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> Paul Roser, On 06/08/2009 06:08:
>>> On Tue, 4 Aug 2009 10:54:37 -0500, Matthew Turnbull <[log in to unmask]>
>>> wrote:
>>>> I'm considering
>>>> reanalyzing certain co-articulated consonants as voice distinctions,
>>>> where the voicing is provided by a co-articulated uvular trill.
>>> there's no symbol or diacritic for uvular trilling as a sound source
>>> mostly because, I suspect, no natlang does this, and also because even if a
>>> human language was found that had all voiced sounds occurring with voiced
>>> uvular trills, the voicing would still be seen as underlying both the
>>> anterior sound and the uvular trill (since uvular trills are not inherently
>>> voiced).
>> But the idea makes sense if the trill is voiceless -- it yields a kind of
>> angry feline growl that can be accompanied by labial and apical
>> articulations. A minute of experiments with this suggests that the voiceless
>> trill would vary with scrapey dorsal fricatives. Perhaps this is how the
>> human vocal tract would attempt to speak Reptile Martian.
>> --And.

I hadn't gotten that it was supposed to be voiceless, in which case, coarticulated uvular 
trilling (or friction) could be viewed as a sort of voicing. I can produce at least /i, E, u, O, 
a/ with just voiceless uvular trill/friction, though some vowel contrasts might not be as 
robust as they'd be voiced. I can readily make a four-way contrast in trills between 
voiced, voiceless, breathy voiced (murmured) and uvular, as well as one that 
coarticulates an apical trill with epiglottal trilling, although that is a bit rough on the 

This now reminds me that I dimly recall seeing a note in the back of the grammar of 
some Papuan or Central American language that uses uvular trilling in conjunction with 
something else as an onomatopoeic word, but can't recall the word or the language. I do 
recall that they simply gave the transcription of the word and noted the uvular trilling in 
the text.

Is Jorayn new? The coarticulated apical/uvular trill sounds familiar, but I can't place the 
conlang it comes from (represented by <H> if memory serves...)