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--- On Sat, 2/25/12, Garth Wallace <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> From: Garth Wallace <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: [CONLANG] Phone*ic notation: Geminates
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Date: Saturday, February 25, 2012, 11:51 PM
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 4:29 PM,
> Padraic Brown <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> > --- On Sat, 2/25/12, Matthew Boutilier <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> >
> >> From: Matthew Boutilier <[log in to unmask]>
> >> Subject: Re: [CONLANG] Phone*ic notation:
> Geminates
> >> To: [log in to unmask]
> >> Date: Saturday, February 25, 2012, 4:27 PM
> >> >
> >> > As Eugene says, it has more to do with
> syllabification
> >> than with any kind
> >> > of phonetic distinctions. If you assume that
> the
> >> geminate consonant is
> >> > split between syllables (not always a
> foregone
> >> conclusion), it's convenient
> >> > to double the consonant symbol to represent
> gemination
> >> and to place the
> >> > syllable boundary between the doubled
> symbols.
> >> >
> >>
> >> that sounds logical. so probably:
> >> it. *fiamma* "flame" = /'fjam.ma/ or /'fjamma/
> >> but
> >> arab. ʕadd "amount" = /ʕæd:/
> >>
> >> You "can't" have long stops. Because they're
> stops.
> >> >
> >>
> >> why not?
> >
> > Because a stop is just that -- the flow of air has
> ceased to flow.
> 
> Yes, and you can do that for a short time or a longer time.

Right. Note that it's not the *stop* itself that is being extended for a
space of time, but the silence that follows the stop. For example, if I 
say the word "PRAT" right now and then go to bed without saying another 
word until tomorrow morning, that doesn't mean that the final "T" of 
"prat" has been going on for some seven or eight hours until I sit up and
say "TLE"!

> So you're saying that pauses don't have length?

Not at all. I am saying that the pause isn't part of the stop. It's like
playing a trumpet. If you tongue your notes, you get a nice TA-TA-TA-TA-TAA
effect. If you stop breathing through the instrument, thus stopping the 
air stream, you're no longer "playing the trumpet" so much as having a 
brass weight hanging from your face. Start buzzing again and the thing
blarts back to life.

All a matter of perspective. Mine is simply that when the air stream ceases
there are no continuant sounds being produced. A stop by definition is not
a continuant and therefore can not be lengthened. Dragging out this pause 
is not comparable to dragging out an extended vowel or syllabic. YMMV.

Padraic