On 19/07/2012 22:56, J. 'Mach' Wust wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Jul 2012 21:00:35 +0100, R A Brown wrote:

>> I did have a quick look in my "Gregg Shorthand Manual
>> Simplified" and, quite honestly, I think that even with
>> my somewhat rusty calligraphic skills I could, using
>> proper calligraphic pens, make quite a good job of
>> producing versions comparable to some of the things we
>> see in Arabic script.

I'm tempted to go & get those calligraphic pens   :)

>> I do concede that Pitman, with its awkward angles and
>> differentiation between thick & thin lines presents
>> more of a challenge; but I suspect Adam could make a
>> fair job of it    ;)
> I doubt it, as I said, on the grounds of having years of
>  practical experience.

'Twould be more of a challenge, I agree.  But I'm sure a
skilled calligrapher could do something.

> Here are some results I find somewhat satisfactory –
> though they bear no longer any resemblance to the
> original short hand system at all (Stolze-Schrey).

I don't know that system.

> They are pretty much con-scripts:

But that happens with shorthand anyway - they generally get
personalized.  I think, for example, few practitioners of
Pitman shorthand ever write things out in full as George
Bernard Shaw did.


Not so keen on the last one. Interestingly, they all appear
to be written in _columns_ like traditional Mongolian scripts.

Certainly I would produce something different, with
variation in thickness of line etc.

Once again I am in 100% agreement with Adam's latest email
"So if an Arabic calligrapher were a particular fan of
English Black Letter ..... "; and Padraic has shown far more
clearly than I have that western calligraphy is neither dead
nor bound by traditions dating from before printing.
Indeed, I think there is a case to be made out that western
calligraphy is currently _more innovative_ than tradition
bound calligraphies of Arabo-Persian tradition.

We all know, I think, the word 'calligraphy' is of Greek
origin.  On checking, I find indeed that the word
καλλιγραφία (kalligrahía) had already been coined by the
ancient Greeks, as had the verb καλλιγραφεῖν (kalligrapheîn)
"to write calligraphically", and the person who practised
this art was a καλλίγραφος (kallígraphos).

Cave paintings show that humans had a drive to be artistic
long before writing had evolved.  I imagine calligraphy is
as old as writing itself. IMHO it's *not* the script that
makes the calligrapher; _it is the creative mind of the
calligrapher that uses whatever script s/he has_.

ζήτω ἥ καλλιγραφία