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On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 8:52 AM, Matthew Merlo <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> >I would be willing to provide help, what did you have in mind though?
> Also, I agree with the suggestions to shorten the >timespan, or at least
> the timespan after humans are created.
> >
> >> So... would anyone be willing to help me with this project?
>
> My main problem is that I'm not knowledgeable enough about language
> specifics to form a coherent language that works,


That's not an excuse. I also knew nothing about languages when I've
started, and was and am learning in process.


> and I also don't really care about learning enough to get to the point
> where I can construct a language well.


That's different.


> I know enough to make suggestions, but the actual constructing is beyond
> me.
>

Second ("first" comes later), don't underestimate Yourself. I also thought
Arabic, Japanese and Algebraic Geometry were beyond me. Before I started.
Not that I've made much success, but nothing that could be learned is
beyond Your capabilities! Believe in Yourself!

So basically what I need is to be able to do is pretty much describe a
> culture and what influences they might have or possible peculiarities and
> then let who ever wants to help to go to work on it... This sounds like I'm
> going "I want you to make me something so i can claim credit" which i guess
> is somewhat the case if that's how you want to look at it, but i am not for
> that. I know I can't do this. I want this for my world. So want I'm really
> asking is that you create this to fit into my world that I can use, but you
> can take all (or most given that I have done some work ^.^) credit.
>
> As far as influence in the world itself. There are lots of ill defined
> things still in my world and I'd love input into them and language defines
> culture as much as culture defines language so I look at it more as a road
> where we're both constructing paths... it's free range for the most part,
> but there houses and roads that i know the location of that you might not
> that might have me go "you can't do that" but other than that, I'm open to
> anything that works within that and I'm more than willing to say "yup I
> didn't come up with that, that other guy did"
>
> As to what needs to be done...
> 8 base languages...
> Dragon, Demon, Alvor, Anunnaki, Fomorian, Fairy, Dwarven, Proto-Human.
> I think the most important of these 8 are...
> Dragon, Fomorian, and Proto-Human
> because I need...
> Human + Fomorian language and 2 of it's descendants
> One of it's descendants that i need is somewhat influenced by the Dragon
> Language, but the Dragon language being base to several other languages
> makes it important.
>
> I do have a bit of the dragon language figured out, but it's a mess and
> I'm someone else could do a much better job than i with my ideas that are
> put into it so far.
>
> As to where might we have this dialogue once we start working on this
> stuff...We can do it here, through regular email, on my forums, but
> ultimately, once these get done they're going to go up on my wiki on my
> site for this particular universe.
>

And now comes the First. So, imagine someone comes to musicians and says:

"Hey, guys, I want to write a concerto grande. Actually, music is beyond
me, and don't care lo learn playing any musical instrument and writing
scores. But still I can be a conductor and a composer. Don't get me wrong,
of course your names will be listed in the titles, so You all get a full
credit alongside with me."

How many people do You think would take it seriously? Especially the ones
who can play, who wrote scores. Do you think people that design musical
instruments will really listen to the suggestions of someone who never
cared to *hold* a violin correctly (if You haven't, it makes much pain for
a beginner, even for the chin and the wrist).

What if people just don't like the instruments this guy proposes? True,
plucking a bow's string was no doubt a terrefic musical invention of its
time, and some can *still* produce quite nice ethno music with it. But
since then there have been invented violins and lutes and cellos and
guitars and shamisens and balalaikas and thousands others, and people can
find out more instruments with the knowledge they have, more intriguing
than a simple bow. The fact that the bow is carved and painted red doesn't
really change the situation.

Well, that may be not a good allegory, so let me put it straight. Why do
You think I have been writing such a longish text about Tae? I just wanted
to emphasize how much work is put there, and how elaborated the world is.
For others conworlds I know, they are not a bit less elaborated and unique.

And now: goblins, demons, fomorians, dragons? They were kind of OK by the
time of Tolkien, since he was one of the *first* to bring tuatha de dannan
in the form of elves form the oblivion, and to *create* orcs from gremlin
and whatever else. But Ursula K. le Guin was producing unique scifi/fantasy
human races just a decade after. Now, why should I be interested in
goblins? Aren't there already goblins in Warcraft and Warhammer that act
quite similar to Yours? Same for the other races. I despise "standard"
races, but I believe there are people around that can create a world where
these races would still be interesting, and You may well be one of those
genial guys - no kidding. If You insist that one can pluck a red curved bow
such that it looks and sounds beautiful - show us, maybe it's indeed worth
a concerto. But if You just believe it's possible to play interesting music
with a bow, and ask someone of us to figure out how to do this, with You
giving suggestions - sorry, I'm out.

You see, I seem to *love* the world of Padraic Brown here. The World he
creates is wast and beautiful, and is full of amazing creatures, folks and
ideas. Would I write a funfic on it? Many years have passed since I have
thought of a funfic on the worlds of le Guin, who I admire. Now you want us
to write not even a funfic on... what? After many years of learning
history, mythology, art, techs, languages, linguistics, biology, physics,
cosmology, often to the detriment to my primary occupation, I think I can
produce such worlds in dozens a week. And I'm still no more than an
apprentice here, who stands in awe before the giants.

I know my e-mail sounds annoying and irritating. I don't expect You to like
what I say. The funniest thing, I know precisely how it feels. It's just...
just like me some 6 years ago, bunching around, telling everyone of my new
fancy world, and saying "you don't understand!" when they told me "why
don't you want to learn more?" So, sorry, someone is to say:

Why don't You want to learn more?

This time it's me. Please don't take it too personally.

I sincerely wish You the best luck with Your project, far beyond the point
where You really surprise me and make me *want* to create a language for
You.

Take care!

Kolya