Wikionary gives "colloquialness", but I do love "colloquiality".  I would eliminate "colloquity" because it lacks the "-al".


----- Original Message -----
From: "Eugene Oh" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Sunday, February 9, 2014 8:53:16 AM
Subject: Re: "if... then...." Sentences; Dyirbal

2014-02-09 7:53 GMT+00:00 Douglas Koller <[log in to unmask]>:

> > Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 20:55:32 +0000
> > From: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: "if... then...." Sentences; Dyirbal
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Could anyone explain the way(s) in which languages which only allow one
> > finite verb per sentence cope with "if... then..." sentences, e.g.:
> > "If you had arrived on time [then] you wouldn't have missed the crucial
> > first ten minutes".
> Don't know if this is what you're looking for, but Japanese has a verb
> form(s): stem + -eba => nomeba "if I drink"past form + -ra => nondara "if I
> drink" (more colloquial) So you get:

Actually the two have slightly different nuances—not just a matter of
degree of colloquiality? Colloquity? Colloquialness? (What is the noun??)

> Ame ga fureba/futtara, pikunikku ni ikimasen (desyoo).If it rains, we're
> not going on a picnic.
> Didn't study formally and don't know how the natives analyze it
> (conditional?). Wouldn't call it a gerund, but is it finite? "Ame ga
> fureba" is not a complete sentence any more than "When in Rome" is.

Conditional. Non-finite. There are only two finite forms, the non-past (-u,
which in modern Japanese has fused with the "modifier" form) and the past

> For a strategy that doesn't involve manipulating citation form, you can
> try:
> Ame ga furu baai wa...  In the event that it rains... (though sounds to me
> more conversationally viable in Japanese; perhaps that's not the most
> suitable translation)

A bit more formal than the conditional alternative above.

> More gerund-y is "nonde", which you can use in a sentence like:
> Kore o nonde ii? Is it okay/Do you mind if I drink this?
> But you could also translate that as: "Is it okay to drink this?" or "Is
> (my) drinking this okay (by you)?"
> Kou